S03 E04: "One Bad Apple"

[YourLittleBrony]

My thoughts on the episode?

~Sweetie showing her first signs of magical ability? Yay!

~Rarity's emergency edible boots? The creators are obviously paying close attention to this fandom in my opinion. xD

But when would you ever need edible boots? Unless.... :!:

~Dont care much for Babs's voice. And her design makes me think she's a tad older than the CMC's.

~Song is very very catchy and Ive been singing it off and on since yesterday.

~That's right Sweetie Belle. Best to tell an adult when you have bully situations. And if the adult does nothing, then show the bully you arent going to take it anymore, and kick some butt. (Hey, I was drilled by my parents to defend myself. Dont throw the 1st punch, throw the second.)

~I looooooove the scroll Sweetie was reading.

~Pinkie Pie making no sense as usual. xD

~Nice moral for kids to understand, especially if they have bullies of their own.

~The prank the CMC's created for Babs? Had the mud not been there, another end result probably would have been devastating.

~Hopefully we'll see Babs again.

[TaleWind]

I actually agree with a lot you say.

I know this is partially my fault for posting a first-draft review in the heat of emotion, but I feel like my stance here has been misrepresented and blown out of proportion. To get back to basics, all I was saying was that "go to an adult" is not okay as a one-size-fits-all answer to bullying. As others have said, it depends on a lot of things. By all means, try going to an adult (or if you're adult, the nearest authority) if its an option, but life loves putting people in situations where they have to do things for themselves.

People need to be prepared for when that happens, and teaching kids to rely on authority is ultimately going to hurt them in the long run. One day, they're going to be adults and then they will be the authority, but how will they manage it if they've never had to be independent?

To put it another way, imagine if Ponyville solved all its problems--Parasprites, Pinkie Clones, love potions gone wrong, poison joke--by simply writing to Celestia and asking her to intervene. Yes, I know that happened precisely once, but that was an unusual circumstance where there was clearly no other alternative. It's because the mane six do most things themselves that they're able to take on gods, diamond dogs, and their own neurotic tendencies.

I think some people are reading me as "wah get gun start shooting people wah!" And that's not what I'm saying at all.

I think I understand your point a lot better now, and it seems we hold similar opinions, we were just expressing them differently. Finding help is good. Standing up for yourself is good (as we saw Babs do to the bully girls), and the best outcome lies in judging each situation individually and striking a balance between the two. ^_^

I am predicting an episode similar to this theme. I think I remember Spongebob did one on the Boy who Cried Wolf. x3 Looking forward to songs from that episode, too! =3

[elsporko]

That is just it though... they rigged the machine to fail, not something to just humiliate her... They were expecting it to go into the mud, because that is childish humiliation, to be covered in mud. However it could have been done a much better way. Every other show I have ever seen do pranks, they were at least childish pranks. Water balloon, pies, sneezing powder, buckets of mud... you know, small direct nonlethal and nondangerous pranks to humiliate. Messing with mechanics is never a good idea. And they wrote it off like it was nothing. That annoys me. Whether or not it was kids expecting it to go as planned, or anything, the writers could have chosen any other time released device that would have humiliated Babs, and pushed her out of the way in the nick of time, subjecting themselves to the humiliation. However rigging the steering to make the float lose control? It didn't even look to me like it had any actual function, but rather random turning of the wheel. Honestly, people complained about Too Many Pinkies having writing issues... I feel this was much worse in how they portrayed it. They could have chosen any prank in the book, and believe me, I've seen enough cartoons to know there is no shortage of humiliating pranks that can be time lapsed that would have achieved the job. And not even a word was said to their recklessness. Sure they made it a point to show that isn't the right way to deal with a bully, and it isn't. But that is horrible, even by pranking standards. In fact, in the real world, that could potentially land them in juvenile detention for reckless endangerment and other crimes relating to intentionally sabotaging a motor vehicle. That isn't just some prank. That is rather serious.

To me, that isn't just being a bully.... that is being down right vindictive. I know that isn't the intent, and that isn't how a lot of kids will view it, but that is how I personally see it. To not even make a point of how far they went to get back at her and touch upon it. I'm sorry, but that isn't right. She played mean spirited pranks, took things of theirs, took over their club house. Never once did she endanger them or the well being of others like the CMC did.

Mind you, I'm not blaming the CMC for this... I'm blaming the writer, Cindy Morrow. What is worse is that I know she can do better. We have seen her do better. She wrote Griffon the Brush-off! I know she is a good writer, she has only done two episodes that I personally didn't like entirely! Heck, even this episode I can't say that I hated, but honestly, for them to make light of sabotage as a prank? Just... no. Sorry, I cannot do that. The episode was pretty decent before that. That whole thing pretty much ruined it for me. And it was planned out, they knew they were sabotaging the FLOAT, not something small inside the float to humiliate her.

Besides... How would THAT humiliate her? That would only garner her pity. If you rig something to crash, the person isn't going to be humiliated, they will be pitied because THEY CRASHED and they were in danger! We saw that because everyone was worried about the CMC! Why would Babs have been any different? No one laughed at the CMC, because accidents aren't funny. That whole thing just angers me. I haven't been this angry at a conclusion of an episode since MMDW. (though MMDW had many more issues imho than this one)

If someone can tell me how rigging a float to crash is humiliating, please let me know, because I fail to see how that could humiliate anyone. People tend to get worried when a vehicle careens off an embankment into a river. (or anywhere, if it really was meant to go off earlier, which again, probably would have endangered other ponies, not only Babs) And even if the intent was to make Babs look bad by endangering others (again, their intent was to humiliate, not deface and get her into trouble), all anyone would need to do is look at the steering column and see that it was rigged clearing her of the suspicions and placing blame on the CMC since it was originally their float.

Sorry for ranting... this seriously has me peeved.

I felt that it was done well. It showed how quickly fighting back can escalate into something out of control and worse then the original situation. It also set up a situation with the crusaders where they could have some tension chasing down the float.

[starswirlthebearded]

I felt that it was done well. It showed how quickly fighting back can escalate into something out of control and worse then the original situation. It also set up a situation with the crusaders where they could have some tension chasing down the float.

Aside from the complete lack of logic that motor vehicle accident=humiliation, the fact that not one adult reprimanded the CMC for doing what they did is disgusting. In no way does mere bullying illicit the act of sabotaging a motor vehicle, ever. Yes, it did show how wildly things can escalate, which would have been fine if there was some acknowledgement of their wrongdoings and their recklessness. Of which there was none. It didn't even have to be long, maybe even a lead into the moral of telling an adult. One line is all it would have taken.

[NoGiantRobots1983]

It feels to me, and I could very well be mistaken, that this episode rubs you the wrong way because it clashes with your ideology of individualism.

It's more like a philosophy of strength. Call me old-fashioned, but I don't like (for lack of a better term) "pampered" people. People who aren't challenged in life tend to develop unrealistic, feel-good ideas and ultimately become useless. Worse, they have a bad habit of interfering with hard-working and experienced people who want to take actions that could actually improve life. There's actually some signs of this in-universe: Diamond Tiara is clearly pampered, so she makes fun of a lot of things she doesn't understand (Granny Smith's habits, for example). I imagine later in life she's going to be one of those counterproductive bureaucrats who is always interfering, unless years of being forced to hop around in a bunny suit wisens her up.

On top of that... I still can't see Babs Seed actually being as big a deal as this episode wants you to believe, in much the same way I can't imagine Angel Bunny tossing Fluttershy out of her own house just because she didn't put a cherry on top. It contradicts everything we know about both Ponyville and the Cutie Mark Crusaders. These girls are NOT social outcasts looking to fit in--if anything, Diamond Tiara is the outcast, and there is ample evidence to support this. I feel like for this writer, the message was more important than the setting and characters, and that's always a bad sign. The message should be an end result of the story, not the other way around. If you have to bend an established setting and established, beloved characters to make a message work, then its probably not a message worth sending.

[Ginger Mint]

hi hi

starswirlthebearded, the Cutie Mark Crusaders acknowledged that what they did was wrong. There was no point in having someone else come in and repeat that for them as well. They showed that the Cutie Mark Crusaders were sorry for what they did, and then explicitly showed them applying that lesson to future encounters with Diamond Tiara and Silver Spoon.

Applejack getting mad at them for causing and then fixing their mistake would have been an excellent example of closing the barn door after the horses have already escaped, though. They had already self punished themselves by taking Babs place.

Now, to be fair to the authors, this was a parade float, not a automobile capable of going at highway speeds. I've wiped out on my bicycle going faster than parade floats go, and ended up with just a few bumps and bruises. I've gone sledding down hills roughly as steep as the one in this episode (on a sheet of metal no less, and this float was make mostly of wood and fabric.) and walked away without injury. However, bullying really does kill people in real life.

((edit: If you want really dangerous, how about when Applejack raced in front of a speeding train in Last Roundup? They didn't have to point out that such an action was incredibly dangerous specifically, it was enough to say that Applejack's actions in general had been wrong.

Yes, maybe they could have done it better. But I don't think they were being totally irresponsible here, they went out of their way to show that what the CMC's had thought was right was actually very bad. If they were aiming for humiliating, why cause the event to happen at the end of the parade route, at the bottom of a hill, away from all the spectators? The writers were showing that this was a personal attack, and that it wasn't right no matter what the circumstances.))

---

NoGiantRobots1983: Philosophy of strength? This is not My Little Pony: The Will is Triumphant, this is My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic. You say you don't like useless people? Well, I say that nobody is useless. Every single person deserves some basic human dignity and respect. I'd also say it is a mistake to classify people into two groups of "people who let me do what I want," and "useless bureaucrats." Please try to understand that other people have different values and they are no less valid than your own.

Anyone who has ever raised children ought to know that helping someone doesn't mean making them useless, because every child needs help. They are dependent on adults to survive learn and grow. Giving them help doesn't make them more dependent, it can help them to become independent.

And for kids that don't have any wider experiences beyond their own lives, the things that are happening to them, no matter how trivial they might seem to anyone else, are important to them. Babs Seed was important because she was Applebloom's relative, not because the Cutie Mark Crusaders didn't think they'd fit in without her approval. Applebloom was stuck living with her.

Bullying does not "toughen people up," it causes lasting emotional damage. Likewise, any kind of intensely traumatic experience is liable to cause long term harm. If you think that hardship will make people tougher, you only need to look at the problems that war veterans face to realize that is not the case.

[Dessa]

This is edging close to personal. Keep it coooooooooooooooooool, kids.

[TotalEcplise]

I don't even know what more to can be said, I find the current topic quite interesting though. I'd like to add something, but I'm the worst person I know and I'd rather not tarnish anypony's possible view of me.

[Ginger Mint]

hi hi

Initiating cooling protocol...

...Now 20% cooler.

I realize that nothing I say is going to make the parade scene better for you starswirlthebearded, its probably the same way with me and the test scene in Too Many Pinkies, but I hope it doesn't ruin the rest of the good stuff in the episode for you.

I just want people to realize that humiliating others is also a bad thing, and just as worthy of the Cutie Mark Crusaders feeling ashamed of themselves. Moral luck at work I guess...

[starswirlthebearded]

hi hi

Initiating cooling protocol...

[image snip]

...Now 20% cooler.

I realize that nothing I say is going to make the parade scene better for you starswirlthebearded, its probably the same way with me and the test scene in Too Many Pinkies, but I hope it doesn't ruin the rest of the good stuff in the episode for you.

I just want people to realize that humiliating others is also a bad thing, and just as worthy of the Cutie Mark Crusaders feeling ashamed of themselves. Moral luck at work I guess...

Oh no it doesn't. I actually enjoyed certain parts of the parade scene, as well as the rest of the episode. I felt they could have done the set up better though for the parade scene, without rigging a machine to fail.

I think I need to rewatch the episode, because I either missed something or people saw something else entirely from my perception. Because, as I recall, they chose to do what they did because she would be embarrassed in front of everyone at the parade. They were going for public humiliation which was retribution for everything she put them through. Which is why they chose her to be the guest of honor, and thus at the lead. They rigged it on a timer, which they set to max. Likely they didn't know where exactly it would go off, only that it would keep her on a straight path where she would need to turn eventually and thus down into the mud embankment, where everyone would see. They also only realized their bad idea was really bad, as they were trying to stop it by themselves. They didn't recognize that what they did was bad through reasoning. Not only that, but they didn't acknowledge themselves to their own misdeeds, because it was a realization that they were merely being bullies, and not only that, but they realized it because they realized they were bullying someone who was bullied themselves and thus became a bully so they wouldn't be bullied. This makes their actions more a result of guilt rather than wanting to do the right thing for the sake of doing the right thing or realizing their idea was bad (ok, granted, that is more realistic, and had to have been done anyway). (and again they realized their idea was bad in the course of trying to stop it)

And for what its worth, I agree with your stance on the test. Both the endings of these episodes were poorly written for no apparent reason. They could easily have been done better. And like this episode, I didn't mind the rest of it. Too Many Pinkie Pies was a gag driven episode, where everything else takes a side seat to the jokes, which I don't mind, so long as everything is actually funny. And I did find myself laughing quite a bit. The paint drying scene though... They could have easily thought of some way better. At least it was only a few minutes out of the episode, unlike this where it was nearly half of the episode from devising, creation, enacting, and trying to stop the plan.

Likewise with this, the whole premise and even the bully was well written. I've personally known people like that. The goal of the episode was achieved, which was to show the wrong ways to deal with it, and to express the right way, which is tell an authority figure. No matter how one personally deals with bullies (as I stated earlier there are several different bully psychologies, and you have to deal with each slightly different), getting help from an authority figure is always the first step. No matter how I dealt with the bullies in my past, I either had direct help from the teachers or their complete backing. One bully was expelled because he attacked me and it was brought straight to the principal, who thought very highly of me, and felt the attack was unmitigated and his record was less than stellar, so she felt, after suspending him twice already, that attacking a top student was the last straw, and expelled him.

So overall I enjoyed the episode, the ending soured it for me. Especially since that was nearly half the episode (from beginning of the set up to the conclusion of it).

[flutterscotch]

It's more like a philosophy of strength. Call me old-fashioned, but I don't like (for lack of a better term) "pampered" people. People who aren't challenged in life tend to develop unrealistic, feel-good ideas and ultimately become useless. Worse, they have a bad habit of interfering with hard-working and experienced people who want to take actions that could actually improve life. There's actually some signs of this in-universe: Diamond Tiara is clearly pampered, so she makes fun of a lot of things she doesn't understand (Granny Smith's habits, for example). I imagine later in life she's going to be one of those counterproductive bureaucrats who is always interfering, unless years of being forced to hop around in a bunny suit wisens her up.

Hmm. I think you also fail to see that bullying can make a person very screwed up and insecure for decades. A challenge is fine. Losing is fine. Getting the short end of the stick is fine. Relentlessly being made to feel worthless by your peers during your most emotionally developmental years, notsomuch.

However, that being said, I was MERCILESSLY bullied from the ages of about 11-14 to levels that these days would definitely be considered criminal, yet I still retain a sense of ridiculous idealism, so way to generalize.

[Ginger Mint]

hi hi

The way I saw it was that they learned what they did was wrong through experience. The show sets up the audience to sympathize with Applebloom, Sweetie Belle and Scootaloo, because of what they go through, and the revelation is supposed to be a shock to the characters if no one else else.

There's a lot going on in the scene where they realize their plan was bad.

• First Scootaloo recognizes that Babs had a motive.

• Then Applebloom says "She didn't want to be bullied, so she became a bully instead."

• Then Sweetie Belle says "Now we've turned into bullies too."

When they realize that what they're doing is equitable to what had happened to them, they not only have their own actions to consider, but everything that happened previously in the episode as well. Because, while sudden, the two sides are now equated. They already established that what Babs was doing was wrong, and her having-a-motive-ness didn't excuse what she did. By getting into the same situation as Babs, the CMC's realized that what they were doing (the same thing) was wrong. So at the end of their reasoning, they realized that seeking revenge is wrong.

It wasn't about giving Babs a convenient excuse for sympathy, rather it was about using Babs' excuse to negate their own. (Babs apologizes in the end as well.)

They didn't feel like they deserved to be bullied, they realized that Babs didn't deserve to be bullied, but at that point in the episode, they were both being bullies too. However, if being bullied is a reason for being sympathetic with someone, then what happens if you bully someone, do they become sympathetic? That's the heart of the moral paradox, if bullying someone means they deserve being bullied themselves, then they would have deserved being bullied, but if they deserved it, then that would have negated the reason for their reprisal. (Why does life have to be so ironic?)

After their float crashes, Applebloom remarks "Maybe we'll get our cutie marks in stupidest ideas of all time." Indicating that by that point she realized just how wrong they were.

It didn't have to necessarily be driving Babs down a hill, it could have been anything really, and maybe it should have been something else. The point was that they didn't think about the consequences until it was too late, and because of that, they ended up suffering though.

At least, that was my take on it.

[TotalEcplise]

Oh no it doesn't. I actually enjoyed certain parts of the parade scene, as well as the rest of the episode. I felt they could have done the set up better though for the parade scene, without rigging a machine to fail.

I think I need to rewatch the episode, because I either missed something or people saw something else entirely from my perception. Because, as I recall, they chose to do what they did because she would be embarrassed in front of everyone at the parade. They were going for public humiliation which was retribution for everything she put them through. Which is why they chose her to be the guest of honor, and thus at the lead. They rigged it on a timer, which they set to max. Likely they didn't know where exactly it would go off, only that it would keep her on a straight path where she would need to turn eventually and thus down into the mud embankment, where everyone would see. They also only realized their bad idea was really bad, as they were trying to stop it by themselves. They didn't recognize that what they did was bad through reasoning. Not only that, but they didn't acknowledge themselves to their own misdeeds, because it was a realization that they were merely being bullies, and not only that, but they realized it because they realized they were bullying someone who was bullied themselves and thus became a bully so they wouldn't be bullied. This makes their actions more a result of guilt rather than wanting to do the right thing for the sake of doing the right thing or realizing their idea was bad (ok, granted, that is more realistic, and had to have been done anyway). (and again they realized their idea was bad in the course of trying to stop it)

And for what its worth, I agree with your stance on the test. Both the endings of these episodes were poorly written for no apparent reason. They could easily have been done better. And like this episode, I didn't mind the rest of it. Too Many Pinkie Pies was a gag driven episode, where everything else takes a side seat to the jokes, which I don't mind, so long as everything is actually funny. And I did find myself laughing quite a bit. The paint drying scene though... They could have easily thought of some way better. At least it was only a few minutes out of the episode, unlike this where it was nearly half of the episode from devising, creation, enacting, and trying to stop the plan.

Likewise with this, the whole premise and even the bully was well written. I've personally known people like that. The goal of the episode was achieved, which was to show the wrong ways to deal with it, and to express the right way, which is tell an authority figure. No matter how one personally deals with bullies (as I stated earlier there are several different bully psychologies, and you have to deal with each slightly different), getting help from an authority figure is always the first step. No matter how I dealt with the bullies in my past, I either had direct help from the teachers or their complete backing. One bully was expelled because he attacked me and it was brought straight to the principal, who thought very highly of me, and felt the attack was unmitigated and his record was less than stellar, so she felt, after suspending him twice already, that attacking a top student was the last straw, and expelled him.

So overall I enjoyed the episode, the ending soured it for me. Especially since that was nearly half the episode (from beginning of the set up to the conclusion of it).

Come to think of it I think the reason they did the float thing wasn't to publicly humiliate Babs. I'm pretty sure they were trying to teach her a lesson about messing with them. As I recall, Babs was bullying them and broke the other float or something, and then they built the rigged float because they knew full well that Babs would take it and that when it crashed Babs would put two and two together and recognize that the CmC did it and messing with them could result in revenge in unlikely ways. In short, if a monkey gets shocked every time it reaches for a banana, it'll eventually stop reaching for the banana.

[starswirlthebearded]

I feel it should have been something else. Again, I would have had no problem with revenge had it made sense, but that was down right vindictive. Maybe it is because from the time I was old enough to walk I was taught to respect mechanics and tools (as well as how to use them and such). And that no matter what you always ensure that mechanics work well no matter what. You don't intentionally sabotage a device to fail, especially a large moving one like a motor vehicle. (Even if it is a low power one designed for a float) They could have chosen to do any number of things, but chose that. Being vindictive goes beyond bullying imho. The message was clear, the method they used to get that message across (the sabotage) was flawed.

Yes, they realized how wrong their idea was AFTER they had crashed. I honestly sympathized more with Babs than the CMC at that point because the CMC went much further than Babs ever did (aside from the classic cartoon banana peel gag). Had they pulled back, I'd have felt bad for the CMC. They made it so you'd sympathize with them, but I couldn't. I can't sympathize with someone who becomes needlessly vindictive. And I have been bullied before.

So while I agree, they effectively broadcasted their intended message. The way they did it left something to be desired imho. And though they said "we have become bullies too" sabotage goes far past that. Sabotage is no longer bullying, that is downright vengeful, and that thought process, was never really touched upon, nor how destructive it could be. That line about getting their cutie marks in bad ideas doesn't do what they did justice, nor the little bit of mud they got on themselves. (Again, what they did is technically a criminal offense in the real world)

And TotalEclipse, I'd agree with you had AppleBloom not said something along the lines of "After the parade, when you look up embarrassed in the dictionary, you'll see Babs's picture under it."

[weesh]

I've been sitting on this episode, waiting for it to sink in a bit...then I came to the forums for the express purpose of hearing positive comments about it. It would have been really sad if all of you had had as bad an experience as mine...

Philosophy wise, you guys have already covered this well. And while I can appreciate that it is not necessary to inform the kids that even the higher authority can fail, that still make the episode incomplete. Growing up I was told again and again to go to adults, and I was let down over and over. Bullying made me an angry and violent child, willing to lash out to physically defend my hurt emotions. I was suspended once or twice a year for multiple consecutive years, including once for striking a teacher who not only refused to come to my aid, but joined the kids in teasing me when I went for help. So maybe this is fine for young kids, but it was painful for me. I hope you can appreciate that even while enjoying your next viewing.

Technically, the episode was perhaps the most annoying ever. I had to look up the transcript for TONS of words, and the song was unintelligible. Note that I have hearing issues, but that overall, this show is one of the better ones for me (subtitles were required while viewing "House" for instance). It is good to see them experimenting with different song styles and alternative animations, but it would be disappointing to see one of this quality again. Repeating animations works well if it is a good set, but it didn't make much sense, and the aesthetics of the chorus were bad. Has nobody mentioned that Bab's colours clash? She is a contender for worst colour combinations in the series. It is too bad because they gave her a fine mane and great expressions.

To cap the trilogy of disappointment, I couldn't get past the egg timer. An egg timer's only output is noise, and yet it caused a mechanical failure. I needed to see some sort of jerrybuilt lever that cut a string or something. I am adept at suspending disbelief (They built a car over night? Fine), but the sabotage was a crucial story element, and it only would have taken a zero additional moments to show a lever taped to the timer. Also, it seemed to have a mind of its own: "I am whatever time left I want to be". It kinda kills the suspense to have a

moment. This worked for "the Holy Grail" because killing the suspense was the point.

The best part of the episode was the redemption at the end which included a cape.

[Ginger Mint]

hi hi

Vindictive: Disposed to seek revenge, intended for or involving revenge. Intended to cause anguish or hurt: spiteful.

Revenge is wrong, period. It is by definition, vindictive. It doesn't matter if it was indirect sabotage or if they walked up to Babs and kicked her face. There may be no good reason to respect mechanics less than people, but I can't think of any reason to respect mechanics more than people either. You ought to respect people and you don't intentionally sabotage a person to fail. If someone is doing wrong, you press down on the breaks, you don't ruin them.

I'm having a difficult time thinking of something that is needfully vindictive.

[TotalEcplise]

And TotalEclipse, I'd agree with you had AppleBloom not said something along the lines of "After the parade, when you look up embarrassed in the dictionary, you'll see Babs's picture under it."

Seems I missed something, that and there maybe more bad writing in place.

[starswirlthebearded]

hi hi

Vindictive: Disposed to seek revenge, intended for or involving revenge. Intended to cause anguish or hurt: spiteful.

Revenge is wrong, period. It is by definition, vindictive. It doesn't matter if it was indirect sabotage or if they walked up to Babs and kicked her face. There may be no good reason to respect mechanics less than people, but I can't think of any reason to respect mechanics more than people either. You ought to respect people and you don't intentionally sabotage a person to fail. If someone is doing wrong, you press down on the breaks, you don't ruin them.

I think you mistook what I meant. Messing with mechanics can lead to alternate consequences. It isn't that I don't respect people, it is that I respect that tampering with machinery can hurt MORE people than the saboteur intended. Which is why it is a crime here in the real world. Same goes for people actually... Sabotage can affect more than intended, whether it be mechanical or sabotaging a person. However, performing a simple public humiliation prank, while acting in revenge, would have been more within the confines of the episode, rather than sabotaging a vehicle.

Edit: Note, they weren't trying to sabotage HER, they were again, trying to humiliate her. There are simply better ways to do that that sabotaging the float to crash into mud. That was needlessly complicated, dangerous and lacked any sort of restraint you'd expect from heroes in a story. I think Cindy Morrow wanted a position where they would sacrifice themselves to save her, and couldn't think of another way to do it. Which again, to me, is bad writing.

[Ginger Mint]

hi hi

I would agree, starswirlthebearded that sabotaging mechanics can have unintended consequences. However, all actions are capable of having unintended consequences, and I'm pretty sure that sabotage would be a crime for its intended consequences alone, if there were nothing else.

Similarly, Babs' goal was to avoid being bullied, and hurting the Cutie Mark Crusaders was a collateral consequence. Her motive was not to harm them, but to avoid harm herself. Harassment is also a crime here in the real world. For instance, I can't imagine that Dharun Ravi intended for anyone to die from harassment, but it happened anyway.

Personally, I think the episode was better because what the Cutie Mark Crusaders did was potentially dangerous. It helps drive home the fact that bullying people is harmful.

(edit: Sabotage is a deliberate, secretive action aimed at weakening another entity through subversion, obstruction, disruption, or destruction. Applebloom, Sweetie Belle and Scootaloo were definitely trying to sabotage Babs. They were doing it in secret, and they were aiming to weaken her social standing.)

---

Weesh, I can't speak for the last two points. (I thought the apple timer was shaking the steering system loose.) but I can definitely understand your issues with the first point. Its a lot like why I don't enjoy hearts and hooves day, even though everyone else seems to love it.

[starswirlthebearded]

hi hi

I would agree, starswirlthebearded that sabotaging mechanics can have unintended consequences. However, all actions are capable of having unintended consequences, and I'm pretty sure that sabotage would be a crime for its intended consequences alone, if there were nothing else.

Similarly, Babs' goal was to avoid being bullied, and hurting the Cutie Mark Crusaders was a collateral consequence. Her motive was not to harm them, but to avoid harm herself. Harassment is also a crime here in the real world. For instance, I can't imagine that Dharun Ravi intended for anyone to die from harassment, but it happened anyway.

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Weesh, I can't speak for the last two points. (I thought the apple timer was shaking the steering system loose.) but I can definitely understand your issues with the first point. Its a lot like why I don't enjoy hearts and hooves day, even though everyone else seems to love it.

But that is just my point. They chose the worst possible way to do it. The question is what did the CMC want to do? They wanted to humiliate Babs like she was humiliating them. Ok, fine. So what was their plan. To rig a float to fail and end up in the mud. Mud part? Fine... Rigging a vehicle to fail? Not fine. Now again, I'm not condoning the act of revenge, I'm saying that what they did was needlessly complicated and dangerous. That is not the sort of thing you'd expect to see from the heroes of a show or episode. I've seen tons of retaliatory pranks over the years in any number of cartoons and live action TV shows alike. Not one was as needlessly complicated, or dangerous as that (and when they were, they blew up in the face (sometimes literally) of the originator without the intended victim ever being in harms way). They fit the show and the situation. This did not. Cindy Morrow probably wanted a saving and retribution scene with the saving being the catalyst to the retribution scene. She couldn't think of a better way to do it, so chose that. Bad writing. The same reason why the Paint Drying test was bad writing. They couldn't think of a better way to do it, so they wrote themselves into a corner and did something needlessly stupid and complicated.

[flutterscotch]

Its a lot like why I don't enjoy hearts and hooves day, even though everyone else seems to love it.

Nope. Creepy as hell, and a whole lot of poorly thought out things + 0 consequences for the CMCs.

[Ginger Mint]

hi hi

I would really like to know if there is anything good in this world that is needfully complicated and dangerous. Yes, rigging a vehicle to fail is not ok. Its not supposed to be ok, it wasn't praised as being ok. I've seen people do dangerous stunts in real life to pick on or get revenge on people, they were not ok. Dunking people in mud and humiliating them is not ok.

(edit: screaming and causing an avalanche that almost crushes your friends is also not something that I expect from heroes in a story, but I figure not everyone is perfect.)

[starswirlthebearded]

hi hi

I would really like to know if there is anything good in this world that is needfully complicated and dangerous. Yes, rigging a vehicle to fail is not ok. Its not supposed to be ok, it wasn't praised as being ok. I've seen people do dangerous stunts in real life to pick on or get revenge on people, they were not ok. Dunking people in mud and humiliating them is not ok.

My point is that there are other ways to achieve their goal without rigging a vehicle to fail. That plan was overly complicated, and their goal could have been achieved in a simpler and better way. In the end, it would still be perceived as bad as all forms of bullying and humiliation is bad. But at least it wouldn't have been reckless and dangerous. And it would have gotten the point across just as well. Again, I can think of at least a dozen shows where there were pranking wars. And never have I seen such a stupid and ill thought out prank to get back at someone. It still would have been perceived as bullying a bully for the wrong reasons. It was not a good method to use, and did nothing to strengthen the point they were trying to make.

And technically all motor vehicles are needfully complicated and dangerous. And they are perfectly fine in my book. This also goes for any number of machines. While the task they perform is seemingly uncomplicated, the process to get them to be automated in the way they are is complicated.

[Ginger Mint]

hi hi

Bullying is reckless and dangerous. Bullying kills people.

[starswirlthebearded]

hi hi

Bullying is reckless and dangerous. Bullying kills people.

Yes, I'm quite well aware. But that is a correlation of suicide. And bullying IS wrong, there is no doubt about that. However, rigging a vehicle to fail can kill because you are rigging a vehicle to fail. And yes, this float was not a full fledged car, but that doesn't make it any less dangerous.