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I am going to repost them side by side so that I can compare them better:

The first 6 words are verbatim, including the most important word in the speech. The rest of the words were modified for the setting. There is no stretch here. This is clearly an homage to Lou. Those words are so famous, that you cannot use them without it referencing Lou. Is your argument that it isn't subtle enough?

My argument is I've heard that before in even day to day discussions with people who know nothing of baseball or Gehrig. If you wanna believe it's a reference, fire away! I just don't buy it.

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My argument is I've heard that before in even day to day discussions with people who know nothing of baseball or Gehrig. If you wanna believe it's a reference, fire away! I just don't buy it.

I'm with Weesh here. Even if they know nothing about Baseball or Gehrig, there is no way you have not heard at least some reference to that speech in your lifetime. It is one of those well known cultural icons that has been parodied and referenced so many times it is mind boggling. It is like saying the words "Lend me your ears" preceded by any number of variations of "Friends Romans Countrymen" for the setting. The person in question doesn't need to know anything about Shakespeare or the play Julius Caesar to know those words. Nor do you have to know them for someone to understand the reference, and the person stating it be oblivious. Just because you don't know the origins of a reference doesn't make the reference invalid.

That speech by Lou Gehrig is legendary. In fact, if you Google those first five words "I consider myself the luckiest" know what you'll get? A bunch of links to that or about that speech. Or about Lou Gehrig himself.

That was definitely a reference, any statement to the contrary is basically denial IMHO.

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Ignoring the majority of discussion up to this point, this what I have to say on the episode.

It moved ridiculously fast. Like, "it was basically a summary of two episodes in one" fast. I feel like it would have been a little nicer if it was a two-parter, but at the same time, it worked as one episode, even if I still don't like that it moved so stupidly fast. It just seemed like there was no buildup to her becoming a princess. It was just, like, "Oh, so we decided, right now, you're gonna be a princess. Not gonna summon you to Canterlot, not gonna give you a heads up, just 'nope, right now' you're gonna be a princess." I don't care that all three seasons have been building up to this point, if secretly, I just feel like it would have been a little better if it was a little slower and spanned two episodes rather than being crammed into one.

Also, I can't be the only one who thought "Did this just become 'My Little Musical'?" Because there was a TON of singing in this episode. Not that singing is a bad thing (I actually rather liked Twilight's singing voice, plus AJ got a decent verse to save her from that **** that was "Raise This Barn") but it certainly felt like the majority of the episode was mostly singing.

At the end of the day though, this episode put a smile on my face. That's a good episode if ever I've seen one.

I am so glad someone else agrees with the "deal with it princess" feeling. Poor Twilight was asking some good questions about not knowing what a princess does or how it would affect her relationship with Celestia, but once again Trollestia is kind of like "nope, deal with it princess" in a nutshell. I understand that time was short and she didn't have much time to go into details, but that just leaves some good sized plot holes and even a few loop holes. I hope we see these get filled in during season four!

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...but once again Trollestia is kind of like "nope, deal with it princess" in a nutshell...

That was not my impression.

The predictable panic in Twilight was caused by two things: fear of losing her friends, and fear of inadequacy.

Celestia address both of these. She assures her that there will be time to learn about her duties, and she assures her that her relationships will not only remain intact, but will grow, even as they change.

Spending more time on it than that would have been overkill.

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I am still having mixed feelings about the whole "Twilight Sparkle is now an alicorn princess" scenario. I felt the writers did the best they could with the 22 minutes they were given "to make this happen", and who knows at the time they may not even have known of season four and thought this was the end. Still I liked the episode, sure it was rushed, sure it would have better if it was two parts, but given the circumstances, they did what they could and making it a musical, especially with really memorable true friends song, that showed talent.

Anyway as I thought about the new Twilight, it had dawned me that I haven't given her a chance yet, and that isn't fair.

change_by_darkflame75-d5vcszz.png

I sure will Twilight, I sure will.

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I don't think that implies a reference. A reference is a tip of the hat to something or a subtle nudge and a wink regarding something. Unless we're going to say every time that sequence of events happen it is a reference to the speech, which would be a little silly, I don't see it. I think perhaps it's people searching for references. I mean, I know more than a few people who believe that Owl's Well That Ends Well contains a moment that is a reference to Bush on 9/11 and they make just as convincing a case, but it simply isn't.XD

There's examples of this kind of vague-ness all the time, especially in this show. Sometimes it's annoying because fans tend to think there is a reason for absolutely everything, even things so obscure like the way a character walks or the stylizing of a certain letter in the credits. As Meghan McCarthy once said, there are references in the show that are pretty obvious, but there are also references that are put in the show that no one ever gets, and there are things people point out that are references that were never intended to be references. Just because you think its a references doesn't always mean it is.

As for this references, I admit I recognized the connection of dialog with Lou Gehrig, but I never thought it was a full connection. Unless of course, you're implying that alicornism is a deadly and incurable disease.

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So eventually, I did get a chance to rewatch the episode with no distractions. And I did indeed love it. The songs take a while to sink in. Sometimes theres that moment of, "oh god its a song" and a dude's masculinity gets in the way a little. Not all of the songs were great, but the main ones were grand.

Again, just like everyone generally agrees, this should have been a two parter. No actually, make it three. Yes three parts!

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As for this references, I admit I recognized the connection of dialog with Lou Gehrig, but I never thought it was a full connection. Unless of course, you're implying that alicornism is a deadly and incurable disease.

I just noted it more as Fridge Horror than a full-blown connection. Taking it to that extreme would be like saying oxygen takes 80 years or so to kill humans.

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As for this references, I admit I recognized the connection of dialog with Lou Gehrig, but I never thought it was a full connection. Unless of course, you're implying that alicornism is a deadly and incurable disease.

Warning: I'm going to read way too far into those few words

I don't think that was the point of the reference. And yes, I'm almost certain it is a direct reference. It is one of those lines that are unmistakable. People misuse quotes all the time for the sake of reference. However in this case, if you want to give meaning to it, I would probably say that it is good-bye to the old to herald in the new. Remember that Lou Gehrig only knew he was dying, not what he was dying of, and that he knew his career was over. When he was going to die, he didn't know, he just knew that it was eventual. But it was the closing of one chapter of his life and the opening of another. Granted that was the last chapter of his life. But he was earnest in his words. Just like Twilight is earnest in saying what she says. She doesn't know what is to come. She is probably extremely apprehensive. It is the closing of one huge chapter of her life, and the opening of something completely new and unknown.

Another possibility is that they used those words because this episode was written before they signed for a 4th season. So they could have been making it into a reference to the greatest farewell speech in modern history to end the series with.

Either way, I don't think those words were by accident. (I actually like the second one, because I really feel like this episode was written as the Series ender, and I like Occam's Razor, which states the simplest explanation is often the correct one)

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Another possibility is that they used those words because this episode was written before they signed for a 4th season. So they could have been making it into a reference to the greatest farewell speech in modern history to end the series with.

That crossed my mind, but didn't it turn out that seasons 3 and 4 commissioned together? Perhaps my understanding is faulty.

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That crossed my mind, but didn't it turn out that seasons 3 and 4 commissioned together? Perhaps my understanding is faulty.

I had not heard this. I've actually not heard anything about commission dates. However considering that the first 3 seasons were made to hit syndication, I really don't think 3 and 4 were commissioned together. I could be entirely wrong though. I did a quick Google search and came up with nothing.

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So here are the two spells:

From one to another, another to one. A mark of one's destiny singled out alone, fulfilled.
From all of us together, together we are friends, with the marks of our destinies made one, there is magic without end.

It makes me smile to think that Starswirl the Bearded (character) might not have been as clueless as Celestia seems to suggest. Perhaps he knew exactly what he was doing.

"Secret unfinished masterpiece" is high praise for a harmful spell unless the intent and planning behind it is part of the charm.

Perhaps "he did not understand friendship like you do" was referring to the fact that Starswirl knew he would not be able to successfully cast his greatest spell given his life of solitude (WMG!), so he intentionally sabotaged it as a clue for someone else to find. Or maybe it means Starswirl was unwilling to write it correctly because he did not want to ascend, and thus couldn't write it, for fear of...

Aside - interesting magic lore:

The spell did nothing when Twilight said it out loud, but transcribing the sentence and especially the period invoked it without her repeating it. This may be the way all new magic works the first time, or just the way certain special spells work for the first time.

...invoking it and becoming a prince when he had reasons not to do so.

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Perhaps "he did not understand friendship like you do" was referring to the fact that Starswirl knew he would not be able to successfully cast his greatest spell given his life of solitude (WMG!), so he intentionally sabotaged it as a clue for someone else to find. Or maybe it means Starswirl was unwilling to write it correctly because he did not want to ascend, and thus couldn't write it, for fear of...

Yeah, not all of us want to live forever.. He might have know what the spell would have done to him and decided against finishing it...Or maybe he was like an stereotypical ye olde wizard. Probably had a few ponies he could rely on, but did not have a ton of friends, and probably kept to his books much like Twilight at the start of season one. (I still have a feeling they're gonna point out some sort of bloodline between Starswirl and Twilight. Maybe he ended up with his apprentice, Clover The Clever and together they started the line of ponies that would all end up being top notch wizards.)

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So here are the two spells:

It makes me smile to think that Starswirl the Bearded (character) might not have been as clueless as Celestia seems to suggest. Perhaps he knew exactly what he was doing.

"Secret unfinished masterpiece" is high praise for a harmful spell unless the intent and planning behind it is part of the charm.

Perhaps "he did not understand friendship like you do" was referring to the fact that Starswirl knew he would not be able to successfully cast his greatest spell given his life of solitude (WMG!), so he intentionally sabotaged it as a clue for someone else to find. Or maybe it means Starswirl was unwilling to write it correctly because he did not want to ascend, and thus couldn't write it, for fear of...

Aside - interesting magic lore:

The spell did nothing when Twilight said it out loud, but transcribing the sentence and especially the period invoked it without her repeating it. This may be the way all new magic works the first time, or just the way certain special spells work for the first time.

...invoking it and becoming a prince when he had reasons not to do so.

I don't think the spell made Twilight a princess. It appears creating a new magic did. Starswirl might have been unable to finish the spell because he didn't have the knowledge of friendship to create the new magic

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I think I liked the episode. Yes, it changed the status quo for the series, but it also opens many more doors for upcoming episodes. I read somewhere that the first two episodes of Season 4 will follow directly on from this one, and I'm anxious to learn how Twilight settles into her new role as a princess alicorn, and if it is indeed a permanent fix.

Will Twilight be expected to stay in Canterlot, or is it acceptable for a princess to live in a small town tree library? As an alicorn, is Twilight now immortal as well? Will she regret being lifted above her friends once the high of her coronation wears off? Also, where was Discord in this episode? And is there a reason for Celestia recruiting so much new magic power recently? What is coming that requires a draconnequus and a new alicorn's power?

If any of these questions get addressed/answered in S4, I'll be a very happy pony. ^___^

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I don't think the spell made Twilight a princess. It appears creating a new magic did. Starswirl might have been unable to finish the spell because he didn't have the knowledge of friendship to create the new magic

That is the problem with WMG; we may never know. I like your theory as well, since it is more grounded in fact than mine.

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A couple of thoughts on the royal dresses...

Option A

It should be covered in stars because I am Princess of the night and put some clouds on it, mystical clouds! Mystical clouds for dreams! It should look regal though, so make it purple but not that 'Royal purple' that everypony uses.... trim it with gold as well, I don't see why Celestia should be the only princess who... Ooh a crown, a gold crown, with my cutie mark on it.

Don't you already...?

WHO'S DRESS IS THIS?

Option B

In a small house in Fillydelphia, a young mare is crying on her friends shoulder.

'Everypony hates them!'

'Oh, that's not true. They were a really pretty design and the Princesses loved them.'

'You're just saying thaaaaaat'

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A couple of thoughts on the royal dresses...

Option A

It should be covered in stars because I am Princess of the night and put some clouds on it, mystical clouds! Mystical clouds for dreams! It should look regal though, so make it purple but not that 'Royal purple' that everypony uses.... trim it with gold as well, I don't see why Celestia should be the only princess who... Ooh a crown, a gold crown, with my cutie mark on it.

Don't you already...?

WHO'S DRESS IS THIS?

Option B

In a small house in Fillydelphia, a young mare is crying on her friends shoulder.

'Everypony hates them!'

'Oh, that's not true. They were a really pretty design and the Princesses loved them.'

'You're just saying thaaaaaat'

I don't understand your post, unless you are lamenting the ugly dresses.

They are so bad, that they took me out of the moment. There was a brief window when I hoped that they had intentionally dressed down to make twilight's gown all the more spectacular, but hers was sub-standard as well.

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I don't understand your post, unless you are lamenting the ugly dresses.

They are so bad, that they took me out of the moment. There was a brief window when I hoped that they had intentionally dressed down to make twilight's gown all the more spectacular, but hers was sub-standard as well.

;-

It was more about the comments they are getting (My design knowledge is limited to like/okay/dislike). It boils down to :- A is a Pinkie/art of the dress reference where the designer was harangued into making a decision she didn't like, B is a budding designer lamenting the bad press she's getting (with a reference to another designer we know getting stressed). Should have gone with my original idea for B and have unnamed designer complaining about Rarity designs....

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Continuity Error: Rarity's special talent is finding gems, not making dresses. Also Rainbow Dash's special talent is going super sonic and making the sonic rainboom. It's kind of a glaring oversight when you consider that in Cutie Marks Chronicles it was Rainbow Dash's very first Sonic Rainboom that allowed the other mane six to get their cutie marks. /nitpick

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Continuity Error: Rarity's special talent is finding gems, not making dresses. Also Rainbow Dash's special talent is going super sonic and making the sonic rainboom. It's kind of a glaring oversight when you consider that in Cutie Marks Chronicles it was Rainbow Dash's very first Sonic Rainboom that allowed the other mane six to get their cutie marks. /nitpick

Yeah I noticed that too. But it's definately possible that the cutie marks are themes and not necessarily driven by one specific talent. For Rarity, its her attention to detail. For Rainbow Dash, its her adrenaline rushes and joy of speed. Applejack got her cutie mark when she came back to the farm after visiting Manehatten. If she really did end up losing the farm to Flim and Flam, would she have lost her cutie mark? I don't think so.

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