season 6 Official Discussion Thread - S056E1-2 The Crystalling

[brianblackberry]

After only a four month hiatus the show we love returns for the sixth season!              The mane six return to the Crystal Empire to celebrate a momentous occasion first talked about last season, except they are not going alone, this time they have a seventh, and I don't mean Spike.  This the season Twilight becomes the teacher, just as Celestia was to her?  Tune in to find out!  The episode airs Saturday 11:00 AM EST om March 26th! (They will play the season 5 finale in the hour before).
 
This thread is dedicated to discussing the episode before, during, and afterwards. As the thread is now open it may indeed contain spoilers. I ask that potential spoilers talked about or shown before the episode airs stay within the spoiler tags please, after the episode you no longer have to use the spoiler tags, but warning, if you haven't seen the episode yet after it airs, this thread no doubt will have all sorts of spoilers in reviews, images, etc. So tread at your own risk.

Also will see about adding links to videos of the episode when they are available.

 

[Hippo]

It was underwhelming of an episode.

5/10.

Too much exposition.  It's not that I need every premiere and finale to have an epic boss fight with a villain, but I just felt that this was a waste of an episode.  It could have easily been one part long.

 

As far as the season though, I am very excited pony is back.  Just because this episode wasn't too great, I refuse to make the popular 'every-season' opinion that pony is dying.  The fandom is not shrinking, and the episodes have not gotten worse in quality over the course of the five seasons we've gotten.  I think it's a mistake to let this sub-par premiere set the tone for the whole season.  I have my doubts about Starlight Glimmer being a believable redemption, and it cripples my enjoyment for her character in particular, but there are lots of things to love about this season to come for sure.  So get hype.

[kunio18]

am i the only one who thinks this premier was abit meh status..?

 

ddont get me wrong its good to see them again but this season two prater was just

OK

[SunsetSombra]

It was fine - nothing big, nothing special...just fine, really. *Shrugs* It's not better than 5 or 4's opener, that's for sure, but it was pretty alright in its own way.

[FrankT]

All the way through I felt the sense of Christian overtones. Look at the coincidences... "Crystalling" has the same cadence as "christening"... and Flurry Heart is born an alicorn powerful enough to level entire cities. She has the devil inside her! And the christening is the only way to exorcise those demonic spirits and save the world! It's like some End of Days thing! No wonder they put it so close to Easter!

[Bellosh]

Hmmmm, I suppose this season premiere was the least memorable yet. It was alright enough for me, but it either could have been more epic or trimmed down to one-episode. Still though, I've seen worse from FiM.

[RarityDash]

It had things in it I really liked. Starlight's plot-line, Sunburst's character, all that was great. I also thought Shining Armor was a delight in this episode. Lots of fun was had there. It was also well written enough, with the characters feeling natural.

All the Flurry Heart stuff though, that left me kind of cold. It doesn't help that I'm not a fan of baby characters just as a general rule (some may recall that Baby Cakes was one of my harshest initial reactions to an episode ever). Really, it just felt so much smaller and lower stakes than what I'm used to for event episodes. It really left me wanting more, especially since the two parters in season five were so exceptional.

The problems were certainly in the idea itself here rather than the execution, I'd say. They kind of had to I guess, but basing a two parter on Flurry Heart just probably wasn't ever going to lead to amazing things.

[LostSanity]

I'm going back to working weekends and I'm going to have too many DVR recordings to watch on Sundays. So I decided to get myself to get used to doing it on Saturdays instead.

What am I talking about? I watched the premier today of course. Instead of on Sundays like I normally do. This is for the best since I'll be working weekends again after this weekend and I'd might as well get used to it.

How I feel about this should be quite obvious. However, either way, for obvious reasons I will put in spoilers. With a simple warning:

Read at your own risk. Because this shouldn't surprise anyone. In fact, most probably won't like this. So either read it and then ignore it and don't respond to it, or don't read it at all.

Spoiler

 

Oh look. It's NOT REEDEMED character. NOPE. GO AWAY NOW.

She's not going away... this is going to be a LONG episode...

I'm waiting for content I don't have to ignore...

NOPE. STILL NOT FORGIVEN. GO BACK TO YOUR HOLE AND ROT IN IT.

Don't teach her anything. She doesn't deserve it.

Still waiting for content... Part of me begins to hope she FAILS.

Crystal Empire. The baby alicorn that I decided to overlook because it was took cute to hate. Yep. Still feel that way. Her magic is... scary...

Plus she can fly. As a baby. I now feel sorry for Scootaloo.

STOP SHOWING NOT REDEEMED CHARACTER. STOP EXPECTING PEOPLE TO FORGIVE HER.

God... I was FORCING myself through this. I'm not even kidding here. I hate FORCING myself to do ANYTHING.

Sunburst is an interesting character. However her excuse for everything she did is still ridiculous. I don't care if she regrets what she did. Go die in a hole as punishment. No I'm not joking. She needs to go in a hole and die in it.

The baby causes the problem. Awkward but somehow not surprising.

So... am I supposed to forgive NOT REDEEMED character just because she helped to restore the Crystal Heart? lolnope. Not even close.

Not surprisingly NOT REDEEMED character and her friend are the key to resolving the issue. Which... I suppose isn't surprising.

*sighs*

Sorry. I really am. But...

WORST SEASON PREMIER EVER.

Too much emphasis on trying to get people to forgive NOT REDEEMED character, which for me, will NEVER happen.

This... isn't the start I wanted. It's not looking good for my future in the fandom.

There were a few funny moments and I liked the Flurry Heart antics. That's about all I can say about it.

With that... I wait for episode 3 and hope it's MUCH better.

 

[Bellosh]

4 hours ago, RarityDash said:

The problems were certainly in the idea itself here rather than the execution, I'd say. They kind of had to I guess, but basing a two parter on Flurry Heart just probably wasn't ever going to lead to amazing things.

Now that you mentioned it, yeah this episode was basically a retread of the Baby Cakes episode, except with a super-charged alicorn newborn.

[CaptainMcDerp]

Spoiler

I personally think I'm going to like Starlight and am pretty excited about where they go with her character. In fact, her plot line was the most enjoyable part to me. I also really like how Spike was in this episode. It would be neat to see Spike and Starlight become besties. The baby stuff was about as good as that sort of thing gets, which was meh. Sunburst turned out to be an interesting character. It would be fun to see more of him as well. As far as rather or not Starlight's redemption is acceptable, I personally think it is. She regrets what she did and is working towards learning the right way of doing things, so that's good enough for me. Though I would like to see her struggle and deal with more consequences for her prior actions in the future. It would make for some interesting development. All in all I'm definitely excited for this season!

 

[SteelEagle]

It was okay. Not great or anything, mostly because I couldn't get into the mai drive of the plot. Had some funny moments and FatherArmor was fun times with bad memories.

[weesh]

Hey guys, long time, no see.

Interestingly, my thoughts are wildly different than yours.  I loved it!

But then, I've always loved relationship-based episodes, and not been thrilled by the action packed premiers and finales.  

Sure, the action, and the execution of the action, and even the overriding story were...not..exceptional...
but there were lots of little moments that I enjoyed with the main characters:

• The re-connection of starlight and sunburst was handled believably, from their shock, their uncertainty, their feelings of regret and shame...
  It made their eventual healing all the more lovely
• Leadership and mentoring are things I'm passionate about.  it was very interesting to see Twilight be such a rubbish mentor, but to learn about how to do it better.
• Spike was a bit of a mentor as well!  He believed in the lesson, and helped push starlight toward the meeting without letting her completely derail the quest.
• Sunburst was obviously struggling with his place in life, so finding a purpose makes me happy
• Any time we see a team work together and a leader who can inspire others, it fills me with joy.  That is the one thing that I typically love about the premiers and finales, so this felt appropriately premire-y to me!

I guess i'm just the perfect target audience!  My desires are so super-specific that I'm not surprised your feelings are cool.

7 hours ago, riverhippo said:

...I have my doubts about Starlight Glimmer being a believable redemption, and it cripples my enjoyment for her character in particular...

why was it not believable to you?

 

[Bellosh]

I actually kinda liked the Starlight and Sunburst portions of the episode. Which reminds me: how many magic school students actually go on to get a career in a magical field? Moondancer and Sunburst turned into unemployed recluses, and Minuette became an event planner. Seriously, Celestia's school sounds like a big rip-off right about now.

[RarityDash]

35 minutes ago, Bellosh said:

I actually kinda liked the Starlight and Sunburst portions of the episode. Which reminds me: how many magic school students actually go on to get a career in a magical field? Moondancer and Sunburst turned into unemployed recluses, and Minuette became an event planner. Seriously, Celestia's school sounds like a big rip-off right about now.

Don't forget that Celestia's other top tier student and protege, Sunset, went completely evil and amoral and tried to take over Equestria.

Best Princess really doesn't have a great track record...

[Cadabra]

I honestly found the B story line between Starlight and Sunburst to be the superior storyline in this episode, mostly because of Spike.  Spike was great in this episode!  He is at his best when he is in a supportive role.  I also liked that Starlight and Sunburst both wanted to show their best perception of themselves, which is believable.  Several of us do the same because we want our friends and family to think we are successful.  Admitting our faults is embarrassing, and that was fairly clearly shown.  

The baby arc was the weaker A storyline, though I did love seeing Shining Armor's character development.  It makes me wonder what he's going to be like if his daughter ever gets married.  I'm imagining something like this:

Officiant:  So, are you ready to walk your daughter down the aisle?

Shining Armor:  *freaking out*  I'm not ready!

Flurry Heart:  But dad, it's my wedding day!  Besides, I'm pregnant! 

Shining Armor:  *bursts into tears*

Flurry Heart:  Dad, why must you always cry at weddings?!?

I have to call fowl on Cadance being so up and active right after giving birth.  Since I'll be in that roll in two months, I'm already learning of and reading about what to expect in post pardom and I doubt flying around would be in that category.  Lack of sleep is going to be a huge factor, but the remaining details, well, I'll spare you guys.  I'm just going to say hospital grade mesh underwear and let you Google the rest.  

All in all, this was the most underwhelming premier I've seen so far.  It was a fun episode, but I feel like it could have been a stand alone episode instead of a two part season premier.  I do want to see more of Starlight and Spike together since they play off of each other well.  

[weesh]

as funny as all that is, it may not be fair to judge the school from so few data points, especially considering how a emotionally healthy student may not make the news wich that they do after graduating.  twilight is probably a success story...

[weesh]

1 minute ago, Cadabra said:

I honestly found the B story line between Starlight and Sunburst to be the superior storyline in this episode, mostly because of Spike.  Spike was great in this episode!  He is at his best when he is in a supportive role.  I also liked that Starlight and Sunburst both wanted to show their best perception of themselves, which is believable.  Several of us do the same because we want our friends and family to think we are successful.  Admitting our faults is embarrassing, and that was fairly clearly shown.  

well said.

we got to see a LITTLE of the classic spike pride prop up in the beginning of the episode, but he was remarkably well adjusted and focused for the rest.  Even when he could have soaked in the glory, he was humble, and pushed the quest forward.  A very enjoyable spike moment.

[Bramble Rose]

Good parts:  

1:  I loved Sunburst's character SO MUCH.  I really wanted to remind him that 'Wizard' comes from the same lexical origin as 'Wise', and that the definition of the wizard is not 'caster of great magics', but 'keeper of knowledge - and knowing when to use that knowledge.'  Sunburst is actually the best wizard I've seen yet in this show.

2:  I'm really, REALLY glad that Sunburst helped show Twilight, "It's not about casting a spell to fix things.  It's about knowing more about what the spell is intended for, and what you're using it on.  About *understanding* what you're *doing*.  ...  not that I think she learned that yet.

3:  The silliness around the infant was a lot of fun.  And no one was required to carry the idiot ball on this one.

4:  I ... think I've seen new fathers looking like Shining Armor there.

5:  The interaction between Glimmer and Sunburst was very interesting and well-done.

6:  Spike got major cred in this ep.

7:  I'm glad Twilight echoed my thoughts on "Alicorn ... baby?  WTF, that's not right."

Bad parts:

1:  Alicorn ... baby?  WTF, that's not right.

2:  That was *not* Glimmer.  That was, like, Glimmer's identical twin.  She did not have the same personality as Glimmer from last season.  She's just generic "Hi, I'm a new character with issues."  S5 Glimmer would do anything to try to make friends.  This season's Glimmer was doing anything to try to avoid it.  S5 Glimmer was confident and full of bravadacio, is very smart, and her confidence that her ultimate goal of friendship gave her such powerful magic.  S6 Glimmer is ... kinda none of that.

3:  The episode did absolutely nothing to help alleviate the broken Aesop of last season's finale which was "As long as the abuser apologizes, just stay with them and give them another chance, no matter how horrible they've treated you."  Glimmer never actually felt sorry for having tortured ponies in the S5 premiere.  She just is lonely enough and desperate enough for friends to try anything.  She never showed at all that she actually realized why her 'forced equality' was bad.  Just this episode she's suddenly talking about how she was 'totally evil' in a kinda cavalier manner.  With Glimmer as this new central character this season... this problem REALLY needs to be dealt with ASAP, because as awesome as the S5 finale was ... the ending of that finale was the worst ending of the entire run of FiM, even worse than Mare-do-well.  Teaching kids to fall for standard abuser techniques is outright harmful.

 

It's important to state this properly:  Glimmer was *never* shown as thinking she had done something wrong.  Even if this episode she tossed it off as having 'gone totally evil'.  Right to the end, all she did was show that she was feeling lonely, whereupon the episode focused on getting the viewers to feel sorry for her, but NOT that she had ever understood what she'd done wrong in torturing and mind-raping those other ponies.

 

What this season needs to do is not have her focus on 'me me me' all the time.  getting friends for *herself*, fixing *her* friendships, etc.  She needs an episode where she goes around Equestria trying to fix all the friendships she destroyed by brainwashing all these ponies and not letting them return to the lives they left behind.  And only then truly realizing "oh no.  I did that.  I took away their friendships just because I wanted friendships of my own."

 

[TheColtofPersonality]

Err sorry about that last post I made a spoiler goof please delete

Anyhow 

I actually kind of liked the premiere 

Spoiler

I actually found the idea of the princesses not being born alicorns a interesting revelation

I also liked the character interactions and the plot while not being epic grade like some others in this show had some great moments.

It does actually seem a tad better then season 5's opener, but weak compared to some others (like season 2's opener) but overall a decent start to this season.

But I do hope that Starlight doesnt overshadow other characters especially characters that still have yet to fully shine (cough*applejack*hack!) I dont mind the understudy plot but i hope she doesnt replace one of the mane 6

[weesh]

12 minutes ago, TheColtofPersonality said:

I do hope that Starlight doesnt overshadow other characters especially characters that still have yet to fully shine (cough*applejack*hack!) I dont mind the understudy plot but i hope she doesnt replace one of the mane 6

well it woudl be shocking if someone was replaced.  1/6th of the fans would mutiny.

it does seem like our favorites could get less screen time as a result though.  I like her...sparingly...if she was in every episode, I might be underwhelmed.

[TheColtofPersonality]

I mean a changing of characters isn't that bad of a idea but it must be handled with care. After all many good shows have ever changing cast but have at least one character who stays on. This is why star trek and Buffy are held up high but sliders and andromeda are held low. Some shows did great with cast changes like House and doctor who but a show that doesn't adapt change well like sliders did ends to kill off the good the show once had

[QuickLime]

I liked Sunburst, 10/10 great character, will app later yes

[tacobob]

 

While I’m gonna say this is probably one of the weaker openers, I still enjoyed it. I loved the bits with the scary baby...Spike and Starlight Glimmer's banter...And I do like Sunburst....I like the idea of a wizard being something more special than just being an unicorn,. My idea was that you can cast ONE spell, you’re a wizard, Harry. But nope. You gots to be good at der spellcasting.

We also got to see the Princesses DO SOMETHING and Twilight and Shining Armor’s folks got to speak!

Spoiler

And Somnambula! She was mentioned. She was an old nasty, human witch in the previous generation(s) she used crystals in her magic. I'd love to see a pony version of her..A horrible youth-stealing pony litch.

Also..

Spoiler

There’s that bit waaaay at the ending that has people talking..You know...That bit...No. Not that. You know.

 

[Bramble Rose]

1 hour ago, tacobob said:

Also..

  Hide contents

There’s that bit waaaay at the ending that has people talking..You know...That bit...No. Not that. You know.

 

Gee, thanks for that descriptive report, Cecil.  XD

But you know, I tossed it off in a few words last post, and I really gotta say it again.

This was a GREAT Spike episode.  Spike really stood up and ... took over.  I thought, "oh no.  Spike's taking over the training.  Here come the hijinks."  But instead... Spike did a good job!  He had good insight!  Sure, he was a little paranoid about the list, but look who he learned from - no more goofiness than you'd get from Twilight.  And his paranoia about the list ... was just to check off that item on the list.  I'm not sure how meta he was being!  That was a wonderfully done scene!  He found an answer to their problem on Twilight's list ... they rejected his answer ... and then it turned out to be the correct answer, later on!  And finally, when Twilight was feeling bad about being a bad teacher... he's the one who laid out how she's kinda being a bit like Celestia.

Which, incidentally, gives us an interesting answer to 'why hasn't Celestia been more hoofs-on'.  Mmmmmaybe ... she's been dealing with stuff like this all along?  Or other princessly duties?  She always puts forth this 'calm, collected, on top of things' persona... but maybe that's just 1000 years of dealing with frantic panic every day, until it becomes mundane.  "Princess Celestia, why didn't you help me *save the world* from your sister?  Do a little bit more about it?"  "Sorry, Twilight, I had to leave it to you because there was a prison break from Tartarus that day, and four other world-ending villains had all escaped, not to mention there was a major diplomatic event that if I'd skipped, could have meant war for Equestria... I'm really glad you handled it, though."  "really?!  Why didn't we hear about this?"  "Oh, Twilight.  If I told you all every time I stopped the world from ending, everypony would be in a constant state of panic."

Back to the topic, though - Spike was ... insightful, resourceful, and helpful.  He had a major roll in this epsiode that did not involve being nothing but comic relief.  GO SPIKE!

[weesh]

4 hours ago, tacobob said:

Also..

  Hide contents

There’s that bit waaaay at the ending that has people talking..You know...That bit...No. Not that. You know.

 

 

I'm sorry, could you spell that out...i have no idea what you are talking about.