Rosewind

This was posted on the FB Brony group a little bit ago. Not sure what to think:

RUMOR CONTROL The "Derpy" issue - it IS a copyright claim. The term "Derp" is not copyright by Matt Parker and Trey Stone as you might expect, it is copyright (May, 2011) by a clothing company in New Jersey. So Hasbro does not own and cannot use the name "Derpy". (SOURCE: United States Copyright Office)

I'm not terribly familiar with US copyright law, so I can't really give any input on the above.

No, don't change your name. Your personal version of Weesh and Alpha Weesh are completely different.

(Also you have to be a donator to change your name on this forum, iirc.)

You really see this as an issue of disrespect?

What part of her letter was lacking in respect or politeness?

Sure it was prideful, but I see this as AJ writing candidly and honestly to someone she cares about. It sounds direct, and lacks polish, but that what she always sounds like.

I have to agree with you, Weesh. In addition, I don't think there's any shame in knowing what you did was right. The lesson to be learned here is that you should take pride in understanding, which is something AJ demonstrated with her letter -- instead of exploring a lesson through a fault or a negative, it was done through a positive.

All speculation and skepticism aside, it is pretty clear that Derpy Hooves' speech highly resembles that of a typical Down Syndrome lisp. It was a very poor choice on Hasbro's part, and now the entire fandom may have to pay the price for it, regardless of whether or not the anger and concern is warranted to begin with.

I'm going to use this as an example, so don't take this as a swing at you, Wily:

This is more or less what I'm talking about. What is a typical down syndrome lisp? I've worked with dozens of people with Downs' and they didn't sound anything close to Derpy. This is just a generalization that draws the negative stereotypes toward developmentally disabled people -- and it is a conditioned perception (usually from outside media influence) based on what some people assume about something without knowing for absolute certain. Someone with experience with the developmentally disabled would have this advantage, though I think the vast majority do not.

Again, no offense Wily, I understand the context of what you're saying, and my comments above are aimed more toward the point I'm trying to make than at what you said, personally.

Definitely a top-tier episode in my book. Hahaha!

I loved Daring Do's look; we got plenty of Rainbow silliness, some new medical ponies, a glimpse inside Rainbow's room, plenty of reactionary face time from the other Mane Five, a lot of over-the-top high adventure, and we got a pretty important take away message: reading is not only awesome, but you can be both athletic and smart. Also, that bit of Spike near the end was hilarious.

Season 2 continues to be amazing.

Assuming the worst, I still don't see the issue. Derpy started off as a freakin' animation error. Any characterization we get at all officially is already better than what we would have had initially.

I understand being upset with a possible decision to change her character, but really, some people are taking this waaaaaaay too hard. It is a background pony whose sole purpose is a nod to the fanbase, meant as nothing more than that. Some act as if a change in her character somehow is a fatal blow to the series. Check yourself: It's freakin' Derpy, not Rainbow Dash or Twilight Sparkle.

Weesh, the page you want is here.

I think the main point is that this is not really an attack against Hasbro for the Derpy thing, it's that the people who complained that Derpy's voice/behavior was making fun of the mentally disabled, and they were reinforcing a bad stereotype while they thought what they were doing was justified -- and Hasbro may have reacted. This sets up a paradigm that if a vocal minority complains loud enough, it can change future things about the series that I thought were pretty awesome (like Derpy's bigger role).

Tales, I completely agree that calm, cool, and collected is the way to go. I did sign the petition, but I haven't felt the need to email Hasbro about this situation...yet When I commented about not being passive, I meant that even though we have limited information about what is happening, we should still explore the possibilities and support our own thoughts about this situation, and it should be done intelligently and with class. But you are right -- until something official is said, we really have nothing to go on.

Derpy is back on WLF and The Last Roundup is up, unedited, on the official site, so I think this situation will blow over very soon.

The video makes a few good points (the company probably does like us -- a lot), though I don't really agree that the community should be passive about issues like this. I doubt it's even possible!

I really hope we do get more info soon. You can't spook the herd and not give a good reason!

Update! Apparantly We Love Fine has added Derpy back.

Behold! http://www.equestria...-love-fine.html

Yeah, that's interesting. What the hay is going on? I wonder if this is some big sales ploy to get people to buy Derpy stuff? But then the iTunes and Tabitha blog thing don't make any sense.

I think you need to outline the mane with a lighter color so it's easier to see. The dark blue and black don't really compliment each other very well in contrast, and make details hard to see.

Tabitha changed her blog to remove all instances of the word "Derpy" and replaced the words with "____." As Derpy is her character (and I doubt she really cares to troll her own fans), could this be a form of protest from her, or influence from Hasbro's backpeddling?

Sending the message that it's not actually okay to make fun of disabled people is more important than the representation of adult fans of the show. This isn't a minor backlash like the perennial accusations that Celestia's royal guards are racist or that every male character on the show reinforces the patriarchy. This is, apparently, a lot of real people who are very upset about what just happened, because of how it affects a lot of other real people.

This isn't "South Park". This is "My Little Pony". The largest audience for this show is young children. Everything that goes into the show needs to be viewed in that light. The adult references in the show are great, but that's not what the show is about. We are not the target audience. Our "needs" will and should always be secondary to those of the real audience. How many of the letters to Hasbro were from the parents of children who watch the show? Those are the voices that Hasbro will pay attention to over ours, and rightly so.

It is nice to know that neither the writers nor the actors meant any harm by the portrayal. In fact, I never doubted that. I have nothing but admiration for the people who provide us with this amazing show, which teaches such good lessons. This was entirely an accident. The writers wanted to do something nice for the fans, and happened to pick the bit of fanon that had a hugely problematic following attached to it. There's no blame to be laid for it (except at the feet of the fans who created this interpretation of the character in the first place). Sadly, though, it happened, and it would have been better if it had not happened.

This fandom has latched on to a lot of the show's background characters, and the writers are acknowledging this. I think SSCS6k made it pretty obvious that the writers are catering to our interpretations of background ponies, with Berry Punch and Doctor Whooves making noteworthy appearances in line with their fanon characterizations. We don't need "Derpy" in the show to feel like the writers are paying attention to us - they are.

I don't think Derpy's appearance in "The Last Roundup" is the end of the world. I don't think it's a disaster, but I think it was a step in the wrong direction, and some children will take the wrong message from it. I don't know how many will. But if they'd given a similar scene to Lyra or Bon-Bon or Doctor Whooves (copyright nonwithstanding), then the adult fans would have been just as happy and we wouldn't have this problem. We can do without any more appearances of that nature, because we neither need nor deserve them.

I have to agree with you that it's important for the parents of this show to feel comfortable with the content and the messages it sends to the target audience, and those are definitely the voices that Hasbro will listen to. The scary precedent this sets, however, is that it happened all wrong, and the ignorance and justification behind it were all wrong. I also believe that the complaints sent were in the minority, as I have seen parents equally delighted with Derpy's portrayal in the episode at large than I have with parents truly upset by it. Outside of any hard data, however, we're sort of blind, which only adds to the frustration.

As I have said before, and this needs repeating: The people who took offense toward Derpy (in name or behavior) specifically because they thought her existence was making fun of people with mental disabilities is perpetuating their own stereotypical perceptions of that group, but they feel justified in doing so because they think they are defending it. Is Derpy really how they see or think about developmentally disabled people? Really?

The non-target audience of this cartoon may not need or deserve any of the special appearances from popular, background, or fanon-spawned characters, but I think that they are an important part of our community culture. To bring something innocent like Derpy into question brings our whole audience into question, and I am personally fearful that Hasbro will start to hold us with more skeptism and a healthy amount of suspicion when making choices about letting the creative-powers-that-be do things for the group -- or allowing things we like and create to exist.

Examples: "We're receiving complaints that Equestria Daily has content on the site that might offend group X Y Z. Please take down the site or we'll make you take it down." "We are afraid that Bronycon might feature content that might offend some parents, so if you run that convention, we'll sue you."

Also...yeah, parents teaching their kids that it's okay to judge people off those sterotypes seems even more scary to me.

We have never seen a donkey yet. What we have seen is a mule back in Applebuck Season, which means donkeys must exist, as he be the offspring of a male donkey and a female pony. I suppose people can argue he was just a sight gag for the joke, but we always held the view that they do (hence donkeys and mules/hinnys are playable in RP).

Oh hm, you're right! I just hope that the Equestrian donkey-folk look prettier than their offspring.

I'm happy for you -- celebrate what you enjoy, and don't let the neighsayers make you think otherwise!

This isn't the first time that a character in FiM has come under fire. Rainbow's sexuality has been topic for debate before. Does her rainbow mane offend gays? I suppose nerds could find Twilight offensive. Maybe her social awkwardness or like of books? I think illiterate people might find her offensive. Or maybe dyslexics.

I think this situation has caused so much stir because Derpy really is our character -- it feels terrible having Hasbro backpeddle her after the true introduction we got two weeks ago. I'm sure there are plenty of reasons that they decided to do this, it just feels very unjust.

I think the bigger issue here is that the way Hasbro reacted was unprecedented, especially since (they might) have responded to the screaming minority in this case. I'm hoping very much this won't mean that future episodes (and the series as a whole) end up sanitized by this ridiculousness, as well as Hasbro's policy on handling its "bonus" audience.

This post was recently put up on EqD that highlights some of the facts surrounding this situation.

Cupcakes...

Here's a bit more chimney think: Isn't the perceived stereotype that developmentally disabled act that way worse than the perception that Derpy's behavior/voice was insulting it? Think about it. The very thing people are up in arms defending is actually perpetuating that very attitude.

I've worked with developmentally disabled people of different age ranges for over a decade, and I can say with absolute certainty that Derpy didn't give me even an inkling that she was mentally disabled, or making fun of anyone with any condition, period.

I think there was a lot of mob-like bandwagoning with this situation too, and a lot of folks sent complaints before understanding the rhyme or reason behind what people found offensive about it.

For some perspective: "I'm going to mail Disney and tell them that Goofy offends me because the way he walks reminds me of someone with cerebral palsy."

I know we've had a bit of discussion about this topic in this thread, but I think recent developments really need some discussion. Long story short: apparently Hasbro asked WeLoveFine to remove all "Derpy" merchandise. I checked and, instead of yoinking it all down, they simply removed all instances of the word "derpy" in their products. This more or less confirms that Hasbro has contacted them regarding this matter -- and it probably gave them a little increased business on the side as some folks might snap up some Derpy merch.

Personally I'm trying to figure out where to angle my thoughts on this. My first reaction is to be absolutely livid with the people that thought it was okay to respond to Derpy's inclusion in The Last Roundup the way they did, with hatemail, petitions, and a loud and clear message that they were very offended by Studio B's treatment and presentation of the character. My first fear was that Hasbro would react in some way, though I was hoping it would just blow over. Without trying to appear like an alarmist, I'm scared that this event with WeLoveFine could be the first set of many things that could happen to Derpy.

To be fair, people are entitled to their opinions regarding matters such as ableism and whatnot, but nothing is worse than a vocalized opinion made in pure ignorance, which I think has happened in this situation.

If Hasbro is moving so far to ask WeLoveFine to rename or pull their Derpy merch, it could mean her future exclusion from FiM itself. If so, I'm very disappointed, and I really hope it does not come to this. The poor choices/reactions of the few will cause consequences for the many, and possibly the removal of a character that was, more or less, our hand in the series itself. I think this negative precedent is alienating the fandom from the company that provides FiM, and the fandom is 100% to blame.

Please, discuss.

No way! I'd say "That's the cutie mark of Luna, Princess of the Night!"

Keep it small, keep it simple. FB is a good spot to look, there are a lot of regional brony groups that collaborate there for meetup purposes -- one might already exist in your area.

@ rosewind:

Personally I dont think making a pony-tail in a genneral furry style would work. Most of teh ones I see are made from long strands of hair notted at the end and attacked to a belt/hook/etc. I know that's how I'm making my Dash Tail (24" lengths of synthetic hair tied together at the end at tied to a hook)

When I said "long fiber material," I was referring to that fact. Long colored dolly hair is the way to go for pony tails. I also said that "this should give you an idea of what's required," and meant it only as a point of reference to the general material and labor needed to make a tail -- I never said anything about style.

It depends on what sort of quality you're looking for, as well as look. Tails can be tricky since you're structurally attaching it to something that doesn't really stick out that much (your backside). Some fursuiters actually attach their tails to a belt and wear that beneath their fursuit so it will get some proper structural support.

Thankfully, tails aren't difficult to make -- the most expensive material you'll buy will probably be long-fiber material. This guide should give you an idea of what's required, though the creativity and hoofwork is up to you. As for the mane and ears, you're probably looking for a partial headpiece of some kind.

Celestia obviously can tell the letters apart by scent. Applejack is apple-scented, Pinkie smells like frosting, Rainbow smells like um...clouds...Rarity like fancy perfume, Fluttershy like animals (lol), and of course Twi's letter will have lots of glitter on it. Also, Celestia will know her hoof-writing (even though Spike writes all the letters). Mystery solved.

Maybe it takes a loyal and true friend to be (sometimes brutally) honest.