starswirlthebearded

If only the leader? Twilight. She is probably the most level headed of the group and can think in the long run. HOWEVER, personally I'd prefer to see something like this...

AJ as the leader, with Twilight as the main adviser. Why? Twilight has the brains, but ponies can relate more to AJ, and AJ has a pretty cool head. She would make a better face of the country than Twilight, also she doesn't go crazy as easily. She can keep a cool head and be advised by Twilight. Then RD would be head of security, and Rarity woudl probably be something like secretary of state (she is a good face and responsible. but she has shown no decision making skills and doesn't deal with criticism well)

Pinkie Pie and Fluttershy are just simply not cut out for politics. Though I suppose FS could be in charge of nature conservation.

HUZZAH! Someone to join me on my journey into the Air Force (I hope I can make it there). Though I have a different reason for joining.

Welcome to canterlot! This community is full of awesomeness and win. And it is 20% cooler than all other MLP:FiM forums.

*brohoof salute*

hi hi

So I tried my hoof at it. The results were alright I guess.

Also: Artax, you may not be able to win, but thankfully its the same kind of problem as going to the grocery store and finding that they don't have any Raspberry Jam, so you have to buy Strawberry instead.

Might I use Ponynaut? I don't particularly categorize myself as a brony or a mere supporter, and that seems like a fun way to put where I am

Oh my, I seem to have dropped a pony-culture reference based on your introduction title and it was, in fact, unintended. How awkward!

Not as awkward as Pinkie in a beaver suit though.

See?

Do you want to taint the newcomers to the fandom? Just... oh dear...

Hello there, welcome to Canterlot! The RP section here is really comprehensive and awesome!

Who are you and what have you done with our Tales????

Also, welcome jun. I am star swirl! It is a pleasure to meet you. I hope you enjoy your stay

Interesting thing I noticed was how the show changed from Season On to Season Two.

For example, in Season One almost all of the mane six were in an episode, but in Season Two the episodes usually have only two or three of the six.

From season one to season two we have seen an evolution with the characters. Fluttershy is less frightened by things, Rarity is not complaining as much, Pinkie Pie is seen as very responsible,etc.

We also saw Twilight downgraded from the leader of the mane six to on an equal hoof with the others. Hopefully her character development will be as much as the others as there hasn't been much other that in Lesson Zero.

Off topic reply spoilered

This post just demonstrates to me the quality of the writing that is in this show. The subtle changes made a big impact after the Gala and Discord episodes (well at least noticeable).

In the first season each of the mane 6 were so different from each other that none of them seemed to get along and only tolerated each other because of Twilight who, at the time was the core of the group. However through each trial in each episode they found progressively more common ground between each other. Thus, by season 2 Twilight is no longer really needed to hold them together as they are already stable as friends accepting their differences and enjoying their similarities, as real friends do. Honestly, such development is rare in any show, especially not a kids show. I've seen adult shows that don't make the progression as nicely as MLP:FiM in terms of interperson(pony?) relationships go.

I can only see this trend continuing as the show progresses, and the relationships become increasingly dynamic.

And honestly, now that I have thought of it like that... MMDW makes a bit more sense (but is still horrible overall). Basically by that point the mane 6 are solid friends. And I'm not sure about anyone else, but I have had the occasional friend who was full of themselves for one reason or another and wouldn't listen to reason and cool down. And that created a scheme to conspire against them to knock them down a peg or two. Was it right? Not in the slightest, but there was a feeling of camaraderie and understanding when all was said and done between all parties involved, including the one who was "wronged" in the knocking down a peg. Granted their scheme was overdone and cartoonish in scope, but I kinda see the idea now behind it. The only thing that doesn't make sense now is FS's involvement as that is incredibly out of character for her. She would never intentionally go out of her way to do that to a friend (though after putting your hoof down, I can see her doing that more easily).

Probably the most notable from my childhood came from soccer, when we asked our coach to put all of us on the reserve team for a practice match, basically leaving the boastful forward without the support of a strong defense and midfield to allow him to score. This effectively changed his perspective on how his teammates affected his playing positively and cooled down his boasting as he realized it was a complete team effort, and not just him scoring goals that won the game.

On topic: Seeming lack of higher education. Basically all the higher education seems to be done through mentor-ship if needed at all. IE: Pinkie Pie with the Cakes, Twilight with Celestia, and the passing down of knowledge in the Apple family.

Also lack of an individualized institution for Earth ponies. We see flight camps for Pegasii and magic school for Unicorns, but there is no special school for Earth ponies.

Also the random continuity error for RD with the Wonderbolts. When she went to the Gala she made it seem like she never spent time with them before, when the award for best young flyer competition was a day with the Wonderbolts. You'd think a day would be enough time to show off her stuff. She even flew off with them at the end of the episode of Sonic Rainboom. Also, wouldn't the other three who weren't knocked out notice the sonic rainboom? I mean that isn't exactly easy and she is the only one that could do it. That alone would probably be reason enough for them to ask her to join (I'm probably reading too far into this, aren't I?)

Edit: I think the tickets were enchanted by Celestia, which is why they all were glowing gold. By that point it was already shown that Rarity's magical color was blue and Twilight's a purplish pink color. It looked to me that Twilight and Rarity's horns only reflected the magic that was emanating off the ticket because their horns glowed gold, instead of their individual colors.

Especially during the Canterlot parties - it's like they're noponies from small town Equestria, rather than ponies who saved Equestria (twice). And how nothing is even mentioned in passing about their exploits.

I always assumed it was due to a mandate from the Princess to NOT treat them as heros, but rather ponies doing their royal duty. She honored them and that was it. I'd assume Princess Celestia did that to avoid them letting the hero worship go to their head. Twilight Sparkle is still her protegee after all.

Didn't Fox originally drop Family Guy off the network, and when it gained popularity on sister channels they brought it back?

There was a lot to that decision, and it wasn't due to lack of popularity. Family guy was already a widely popular show, it just gained more notoriety on sister channels.

I'm not sure what you mean... The trend has been happening if you mean rebooting old series... Thundercats, pretty much every superhero cartoon, especially Batman and Spiderman (seriously, how many shows are those two gonna get?), TMNT, GI Joe, Transformers, Pound Puppies, Strawberry Shortcake...

If you mean making shows more ambiguous for boys and girls (ieL shows meant for girls that boys can enjoy, or shows meant for boys that girls can enjoy)... That is where things get murky, especially for the former. Lauren Faust has a gift. My friend and I have a joke that she is related to the original Faust, and that is how pretty much every show and movie she touches turns to gold. (And if I make it to BroNYCon and she has a Q&A panel, I'm totally asking her that question, and if you are not sure what Faust is, I encourage you to Google it, great German legend). That said, I really hope she does more shows.

Really, I'm wondering why networks aren't allowing her and Genndy run wild. The two of them are geniuses, and deserve to be set free from the shackles that the networks put on them. Both have had an amazing history of making wildly popular shows that have become legendary and won awards. What are networks afraid of with those two? Better ratings? Attach either of those two names to a production and people will watch just for that (at least I know I would). Symbiotic Titan was just phenomenal, and needs to be brought back. And I NEED to see Galaxy Girls (with all the fan buzz, why hasn't it happened yet?)

Sorry for the OTness...

Quite frankly, I would love to see three reboots in particular... Fox's Peter Pan and the Pirates (They should axe Jake and the neverland pirates for this), Pirates of Dark Water (I MUST SEE THE END), and Sonic SatAM.

Oh and maybe ReBoot, just for the punnie.

Sorry... been up all night and am a bit crazy

That is a great response from Amy Keating Rogers. Really a fantastic read, and it is nice to know that she had some input.

I know I have said this before, but my only wish for that scene was that it would have gotten better editing. The editing was atrocious and that, and only that, is what I cannot forgive. Everything else is cool in my book.

On a side note, I would love to see them release a directors cut, or an extra that has the story board for the extended scene!

On this quote to Gawker:

If one couldn't find any information on Nicole Angello, it turned out Gawker spelled it wrong. It is Nicole Agnello, not Angello. Using the right spelling there are Hasbro stuff on her so it looks legit, even if Gawker again goes on the fail boat for misspelling her name.

Class act that Gawker. Misspelling a source's name. So, at least we can believe them now... Seems legit. I want to contact her and ask her why Gawker of all places...

If by fabricated you mean that Hasbro and Hub were coordinating a message to publicly release, then yes, it's pretty clear the the folks at the Hub were waiting for an official statement from Hasbro, since Hasbro calls the shots.

This is the straight dope folks, I've been working with this PR person at the Hub for weeks (she set me up with an interview with Jayson T last friday). It's also totally understandable, since the last thing Hasbro needs is a parent's boycott of the toys.

I'm somewhat amazed by the sense of entitlement some folks in the Brony community feel they are due. We're not the show's primary audience, and we should be on our knees in gratitude for the fact that we get the shout-outs and adult references that we do get in the show. The more we become a hassle to Hasbro, the more likely they are to turn the show into Strawberry Shortcake: The Next Generation, because it's just not worth the trouble.

Ask yourself, is that really what you want? Would you rather have no new episodes, or lousy ones, just to 'save Derpy'? If you want to be frustrated or saddened at someone (not angry, that's an emotion that should be left to Glen Beck disciples and Call of Duty trash-talkers), direct it at the culture that has become so hypersensitive to this kind of dreck. Frankly, I'm a thousand times more disappointed at the obscenity-spewing, vitriol-flinging hate-fest that portions of the Brony community have participated in over the last few weeks. We're better than that, or at least I though we were. I thought I had found a group of people who wanted to apply the idea of love and tolerance to the world. Over the last few weeks, it's looked too much like what the demographics would have you believe it is, a bunch of immature young adults and teenagers.

Love and tolerance is like freedom of speech. It's easy to love and tolerate things you agree with, or only mildly disagree with. The trick is to love and tolerate people who you don't agree with at all. I'm not Christian, or religious at all, but the idea that you have to love (in the sense of want them to get better and more happy) people who may hate or despise you isn't a bad one. It's pretty easy to call down the Windigos in what you think is righteous anger. We've been given this marvelous gift of a show, and rather than actually listen to the message it's trying to teach us, we're using it as an excuse to do the exact opposite.

Everypony needs to grow up a bit. If Derpy being called out by name was the core of your existence, and the redacting has destroyed your life, I'd like to direct you to the community mental health section of your local yellow pages. I want to enjoy this show with people who are more interested in being happy than angry. If anger is your thing, I hear 4chan is a great place to get a head of steam going. Personally, I avoid it like the plague. There's enough crap going on in the real world that makes me want to turn in my citizenship in humanity, I don't need to manufacture more over a blond background pony's name.

Interesting. I'm just looking for confirmation to be honest because I don't trust Gawker. If it was almost any other news outlet I'd not have questioned it. The quote itself does seem legitimate though, which is why I contacted the Hub's PR department for confirmation.

And I agree, it is a logical choice from a business stand point, except the lack of effort on the edit. But I suppose I can live with that since I have the original. I'm more angry at the quality of the edit rather than the edit itself. I'm a stickler for quality (Which is why I refused to believe it was entirely Hasbro's doing) Perhaps Hasbro told the production team to do it, and THEY weren't happy with it, so they put no effort in. I've just been trying to make sense of the awful edit basically...

I actually don't mind the voice (I do wish it was less generic though). And I could care less about the name tbh. It is a fan name and should have remained as thus.

This is almost exactly the same wording I got from my contact at Hub PR today, it's legit.

Coder

I'd really like to see some of these emails... I just emailed them myself questioning the validity. If it is legit, fine, but I really wish they would have chosen a better news outlet than Gawker, who are really known for being trolls.

So Apple had nothing to do with it. Called it!

It is nice to get some real, solid information! Anypony thought of emailing Nicole Angello about this and pawing around for more info? That would be the source to go to.

Funny you should mention that. I couldn't find her name on any Hasbro Press Release... I wanted to email her, couldn't find her email address anywhere.

Edit: I found other Hasbro emails from their PR team and used their set up to contact her. And big surprise, it was rejected. I'm going to contact their Media contact information.

Here is the latest:

As reported on Derpyhooves News; the actual article is here, take Gawker with a grain of salt overall, it doesn't have a good credibility rep with the fandom.

They don't have good rep period. Their business model is very simple (along with their other sites)... 1) Make article that is offensive or emotion provoking to people or a group. 2) Broadcast this article everywhere getting people to read the tripe by clicking their site 3) ??? 4) Profit (OK so 3 is really getting clicks for ad revenue)

The only site that has some merit (not much mind you) is LifeHacker. But even those articles are 90% from Reddit.

Seriously. I don't read Gawker or anything else from any of their properties. They have the journalism skill of a monkey. They make Fox news look talented and unbiased.

Hasbro apparently responded. Though I'm curious why they choose Gawker, whose credibility is worse than Fox. Seriously, why not contact EqD directly? They would have been the better choice. It was their choice to change the one episode.

Let me challenge that. Be honest. If you had seen the new version first, would you really have noticed? Imagine if afterwords, they changed it to the boy derpy voice. Then what? Probably the same thing if you ask me.

You could change any scene in any episode about anything in FiM. It doesn't matter how much better it may be, people will complain.

Put simply? Yes. In fact I showed my friend both clips, and she instantly picked out the original, and she has not yet seen the show. The edit was a hack job that wasn't up to snuff. Simple as that.

That picture made me laugh more than expected. Good show Brian!

That said, I'm not sure how many people are panicking anymore. It has already happened, so panic time is over. Really, now it is deliberating what exactly happened. We really can't blame either side for doing what was done. Amidst controversy, action had to be taken, Perhaps most would have preferred a public statement explaining the chosen characterization as well as the meaning of the word "derpy," but unfortunately we have no say. In the end, either Apple or Hasbro decided to make this scene PC. Either way it happened, Hasbro signed off on it begrudgingly or not, and made the changes. Was it just for iTunes? Was it across the board? These are the questions that most people are wondering. And really, we won't know until Hasbro steps out and either says something or we see the episode reaired.

@Riverhippo: I agree, except that I think fans want closure more than anything. The censorship happened, but we know nothing else. Petitions have been signed, and I'm sure Hasbro and the Hub were both emailed to death by irate fans. So I certainly agree, we have done enough.

Also, if any fan thinks like that, I'll be sorely disappointed in this fandom. If the name returns, the censorship should be viewed as a fluke to appease the outcry. And the return of the name should be viewed as Hasbro and co's respect for the fandom, not caving in or "losing." This isn't a battle to be won.

In fact, the only reason why I'm annoyed by the edit is because the edit is atrocious. It looks like it was thrown together and neither VA seemed terribly invested in it. It was poor work. If they rereleased it a 3rd time with better editing I'd be extremely pleased, despite the name being cut out and the voice changed. Derpy will *always* be Derpy, whether it is acknowledged by the show or not. As I recall, they released a toy of Lyra with the name Heartstrings, yet, it seems to me that most fans seem to refer to her as "Lyra" still. So even if they change the name to something else (which I don't think they will, as they have used the name publicly before and most of the creative team seems to like it), within the fandom Derpy's name will not be changed, which is where the character and all of her lovable clumsiness really was born. Even the dropping of the furniture on Twilight in Feeling Pinkie Keen was a nod to the fandom, because that was after she was named and had tons of material written and drawn about her.

Oops, I edited my post to clarify my metaphor but you already read/replied. Oh well. We had a nice little debate though, eh? Have a cookie.

It was indeed.

For fun, I'll give a quick reply to your revised scenario... It really depends on the situation (again). If it was the same situation as Apple and MLP, then yes, the same thing will happen. Car is shipped with defect, defect becomes known. Company refuses to do anything about it, it is up to the distributor to refuse to sell it, until the situation is rectified. If you sell a known defective product, you are just as liable as the manufacturer whom produced it.

On the other hand, if the distributor is unaware of the situation, then it is not their fault, but the manufacturing company specifically. But if that defect becomes known, it is again up to the distributor, with or without the notification of the manufacturer to cease sales.

Thanks for the cookie Here is a brownie as an exchange

So by your logic, if someone buys a car, and gets in a car accident, they should be upset with the car company that made the car? I know that metaphor has been done to death, but that's what I'm seeing from your side of the fence. Maybe that is the logic at play here. Maybe some people won't take responsibility for their own tolerance and need for political correctness, so they hold that standard to other entities besides themselves.

For my other theory, I was suggesting that Hasbro has only adjusted content you have to pay for outright. The website and on-demand services don't cost the consumer anything (they pay by watching advertisements), so I think Hasbro might treat that crowd differently than the paying one that has a right to gripe or question the content since they actually made a monetary purchase from the company. By this logic, I'm most certainly not underestimating Hasbro, nor do I disagree that I should discount Apple -- I just think people are giving them too much credit in this situation.

As for your opinion about all this, and whether or not Apple was a player in the change of Derpy, I think we're going to have to agree to disagree on this, Swirly!

Car company eh? Depends on the situation... Like the whole Toyota brake debacle from not too long ago. People got into accidents, and the cars had passed QC. Toyota claimed it was a nonissue, until it was found that it was. People, before learning the truth, did in fact blame Toyota. So yes, it is possible to blame the car company depending on the situation and range of scope.

However, that is not the same as this issue at hand. A more accurate comparison with cars would be if say a car company released a car with a rainbow colored paint job and issued a recall on that based on people crying foul for homosexuals (regardless of the actual intent of the paint job in question). It is a PR problem, not an issue with individual views. Which would happen and the cars would be immediately repainted with a public announcement apologizing for any offense caused (Something that is oddly missing in this story here).

That said, I agree. I think we have both argued our respective views admirably, and neither of us are actually sure of what is happening. So lets agree to disagree until the end of March when we will hopefully have the answer to all of this when they reair the episode. And if they don't, I'll be quite cross at Hasbro/Hub for just sweeping this under the carpet.

I don't know any business that will sweep a product under the carpet in the way you're describing. Large businesses tend to make a lot of money, but only because they make money in smaller amounts. Cost control is paramount to this business strategy, and storing away a warehouse of DVDs, never to be sold, because of a minor change to one episode on the disc, is not good business by any degree, even to save face or whatever have you -- unless the product was, of course, defective or dangerous to the consumer.

You make some interesting arguments about how Hasbro's infrastructure works. Do you have any evidence to support this information that you're putting forth? You're saying a lot that does make sense, but I can't see how any of it can really be confirmed.

Again, it's speculation, and it's going to continue to be speculation until some real information is provided from a viable source. I'm afraid I'll have to disagree with what you are saying because I don't think there is a way to confirm how Hasbro's business infrastructure works, especially with episode distribution.

Fact:

Actually... Hasbro is a publicly traded company, so you should be able to find that information somewhere. From the looks of their executive structure it is exactly as how I described. It is a top down system with one section leading back to one executive (pretty standard in business as far as I know). Just about everything can be found on Hasbro's corporate site.

Pretty much everything I read on http://www.hasbro.com/corporate/ lead me to that conclusion. But I accept the fact that it is late for me, and I can't read through 100s of pages of information, so I may have missed something or misconstrued something.

Opinion:

Reputation is more important to most companies than a slight loss. They would rather lose $1 million now, than lose thousands of potential customers because of some issue with media. You have to think about it this way... What will cost them more (considering that they saw this as a big enough issue to revise the episode and rerelease it)... Taking the $1million hit by ceasing distribution of the potentially harmful material, or potentially losing x number of customers because they refuse to buy products from a company that is so insensitive to people with mental or physical disabilities (or what ever the issue was)? Companies take losses all the time to prevent potentially harmful media. They would rather take a slight hit, than take a huge one from people refusing to buy in the future because of some scandal. If they printed out say 50000 copies of that DVD, and 12000 landed in the hands of parents or fans whom were offended, that is potentially 12000 less people who will buy from them in the future. And that money ads up far faster than $1million from the start. I believe the business term is "Acceptable Loss." And yes, it is a more common business practice than you may think.

Rosewind, they get money from all sources. Ad revenue from their site and on-demand, and people buying from iTunes. Either way there is money involved. And I cannot see the two being separate, unless you are suggesting that there are multiple distribution teams (one for TV, iTunes and Internet). And if that is the case, are they autonomous, allowed to disregard the ruling of Hasbro? Seems unlikely to me. Though usually companies have one team for each area, though the size of said teams can be quite large (PR, Distribution, Legal, Corporate...). It is unlikely that they were simply "missed," because of the size of Hasbro. They have teams of people searching Youtube to ensure that no episodes are posted there, do you really think they don't have the man power or foresight to check their own property? I think you are underestimating Hasbro. There must be a reason for this oversight, it doesn't make sense to me.

If it is an oversight, it would have been corrected by now, unless you are suggesting that they didn't care enough to not at least take the episodes down from those sources, regardless of changing them. Which again, seems unlikely if they cared enough to expend more money to do the edit (which does cost a bit of money in studio time, animation editing department and sound editing department). I don't know, this all seems strange to me.

I really hope we get our answer next month...

Also Apple could have done it of their own accord to avoid being wrapped up in the situation. Believe it or not, distributors are also blamed if they are distributing something that they know is offensive. If Hasbro refused to act because they didn't see an issue, the public's eye would easily turn to Apple whom was selling the product and didn't take it down. It has happened before.

And btw, ceasing distribution wouldn't cost them that much. All that would happen is that the DVDs would end up in a warehouse somewhere, never to see the light of day. Hasbro is a 4 billion dollar company. I think they could handle a couple of million dollar hit if it meant preserving their reputation. I mean it has been done in the music industry too. Just read up on the Black Flag debacle over their CD Damaged. And that was back when internet didn't exist so people actually bought physical media. So with iTunes revenue set and in tact, why do you think they would care taking a small hit in ceasing distribution of that DVD?

(BTW, I do understand what you are saying, it just doesn't make sense to me personally, and likely won't unless Hasbro comes forward and says something)

As I said, both companies have an image to protect and don't want to be caught up in a controversy, the question is which one acted on it. Apple has the right to pull material they feel is unsuitable for their services. It has always been that way. So was it Hasbro who requested it? Or was it Apple that acted of their own accord.

The latter seems more likely, unless someone can explain to me why the episode was not removed from the Hub site when it was removed from iTunes, and why I can still access the unedited episode from the Hub On-Demand service on FiOS. For some reason I think that if it was Hasbro's doing, they would have taken it down from everywhere, and changed it everywhere. You know, issued a recall on the DVDs, taken the episode off their site, and off THEIR joint network with Discovery Communications. It would seem to me, that would be the first thing they would change it on since THEY directly control it, unlike iTunes which is maintained and controlled by Apple.

Please, everyone who is blaming Hasbro explain this logic to me. I'm clearly not getting it. Changed on iTunes, but not on the Hub On-Demand? (Seriously, I'm highly confused by this train of logic, I'm watching the unedited episode this very minute on Hub's on demand service)

Regardless, if the Hub is going to follow the current pattern for reruns, we will have our definitive answer the week of March 12th or 19th. The episode should have reaired by then.

We really don't know who is responsible. Both companies are interested in their own self image and likely did not want to be caught in a controversy. However, I'm leaning towards Apple for the sole reason of quality. If it was Hasbro's decision, I feel like they would have made more of an effort. The edit job is atrocious. I can't see a production company putting out such sub standard work willingly.

It has been a few days since the episode was put back on iTunes, I'm going to check on hub on demand again to see if it is changed there, which is directly controlled by Hasbro as partial owners. If it isn't changed there of all places why would we assume it was their decision? It doesn't make sense that they would leave the unaltered version on their network on demand and have an altered version for sale on iTunes.

given her view that FiM is just "the latest MLP" she may claim she's watched it because "they're all the same" but yes, you have a good point...

lol, yes, isn't is great how in anime you can stop falling (background stops scrolling) because your talking? (not to mention falling 1 or 2 stories can take upto the full 30 minutes thanks to dialog or fighting) or you can be half-way into a car, basically balancing on the door of a convertable, and hold that pose for 5 minutes for a conversation? Animation quality, with a few exception, is relatively low for anime --- I'll be the first to admit I dont watch it for the art (though as I said there are a few exceptions, Hayao Miyazaki's work comes to mind) for me it's all about the serialized plot, one giant story, and the fantasy elements (though now that both are finding their way into more western series...) With her though, your absolutely right, she'll argue about the quality of the art till she's blue in the face because "hand drawn anime" is superior to CGI or live-action... yeah... sure...

I've had the argument many times with her that plot > art, but she wont hear it, she'd rather watch a show or play a game with high-quality art (or what she considers high-quality) than a deep and powerful story while I still play ZORK...

That is just it... Most anime is NOT hand drawn anymore, except for a few key frames. The rest is done by COMPUTER. I really wish I could drive that into the minds of anime fans. In any given episode of anime, you might see only 10 hand drawn frames of thousands. It is far too expensive to have hand drawn animation anymore. And for anime, that nearly died in the 90s and was saved by American and Canadian licensing companies, they would not waste money on doing hand drawn animation. It looks like it is hand drawn likely because of the key frames, but in reality it is not.