Sonic the Hedgehog General Thread

[firework]

As far as I know the only real flaw I can think of in colours was the boss fights. The normal bosses were fine the first time, then they went and copied them (heck they even pretty much used the airship battles from Sonic Hero's as well). Though I hear the last boss was pretty awesome, I haven't beaten the game so I can't really tell. Also, some people probably don't like it with the "gimmick" excuse what with the different powers given by aliens. The story is straight forward which is fine though I don't mind when it has a little more meat to chew on.

So what do you guys think will be next in store for sonic? do you think we will see a sonic 4: Episode 3? ( Unless it pulls a valve thing ) I personally would love a game as long as unleashed but without those quick time event things and I still cling on to that spec of hope that hyper sonic would one day return. haha

I think I'm also the only person on the planet who wants silver to have his own game...

No you are not, I would love to see a sliver based game (that is actually fully finished WITHOUT a golfing level grrrr). I'd also like hyper sonic to return, but only if other characters would get super forms again. Come on Sega give me my super tails back.

ah sonic, i remember those games.

is it odd that i lik the new sonic charecters (like shadow, etc)? other sites iv been to they dont like the newer charecters on sonic. xD

You're not alone, plenty of people like the new characters. Myself included.

[NeoExlucky]

I like a lot of the new characters, it's some of the voice actors I hate. Like the voice actor for tails in sonic heroes was so annoying. (Tails is my favorite character.) Luckily The voice actor for tails in generations was pretty good.

[Needlemouse]

I think the major problem with the Sonic series is the lack of proper thought put into the presentation of the cast. That is to say that they should really be utilizing the characters when their presence warrants it or if it makes sense for the character to be there. For one thing, Sonic Unleashed was a major lost opportunity to put Knuckles back in a main character role as the co-star for the game (there was talk in the first place of Knuckles possibly being involved in Unleashed). I think Unleashed would of gone over way better if they'd used Knuckles instead of the Werehog, for example. The character is perfectly suited to the melee-based gameplay that the Werehog had. Narratively speaking adding him would have made sense too, as the draining of the Chaos Emeralds could of been explained as having affected the Master Emerald too, giving the echidna a reason to leave Angel Island and figure out what was going on.

Again, we see a lot of problems with exactly this. There's very little thought put into 'why is this character here, and should they be?' One of the bazillion plot holes for Sonic '06 was Shadow working for GUN, which just made zero sense at all and only served as an excuse to force the character into the narrative. Similarly, Shadow's appearance in Heroes was just a response to fans demanding 'MORE SHADOW' without them really thinking on a good way to bring him back, and thus we had the whole mess of the 'Shadow the Hedgehog' plot too.. ick. Personally, I like Shadow just fine - or I should rather say, I liked Shadow back in SA2, when he had a more solid and concrete character. After the amnesia (and thanks to Jason Griffith's horrible voice-acting), Shadow more or less just became 'Dark/Goth Sonic'. Whiiiich was a really weak decision.

Similarly there's more of those same problems in Sonic Heroes: Why is Knuckles there when he should be on Angel Island guarding the Master Emerald? Why is Rouge looking for 'Eggman's secret treasure' at the start when she only focuses on stealing jewels, and has no idea what it is? He's a scientist, his secret treasure could be a death ray for all she knows. Amy's just there stalking Sonic as usual (a sad departure from her character development in Sonic Adventure wherein she decides she's going to become more independant - opening the option of her becoming a spunky, energetic character that can handle herself while still being girly), the additions of Big and Cream were kind of a stretch with the abductions of Froggy and a chao..

..really the only characters that made sense to be in Sonic Heroes were Sonic, Tails and the Chaotix - and quite frankly, if they'd stuck to those guys, you'd have a pretty solid game. The Chaotix being hired by a captured Eggman to bail him out was a good twist, and you could've implemented a lot of good gameplay mechanics utilizing Espio's ninja skills (considering SEGA's own Shinobi franchise, this could of been done amazingly), Vector's muscle and the fact that he's a crocodile to go through underwater stages, and Charmy's.. ..okay, I got nothing there, so sue me. That's still five unique and distinct characters you coulda used in the same Sonic Adventure'y narrative format, each with distinct enough gameplay styles to make things interesting, rather than oversaturating the roster with too many characters, and thus forcing you to experience a repetitious game where they all play the same instead. On top of which, it'd also mean that more than half the cast would be new (in a manner of speaking), meaning a fresh approach and new things to bring to the table.

This is the core problem, like I said.. trying to squish too many characters into one little disc means you're sacrificing variety of gameplay and thus all the characters are pretty much just reskins of one another and not in the least bit interesting or fun to play as. The first Sonic Adventure had this down.. the second one really didn't, even down to relegating Tails to a mech just so they could have three characters on each side of the narrative (as I recall it, they hadn't even planned to have Tails in SA2, and it was one of the decisions they made while they were already well into making the game, thus explaining why his gameplay is just copy-paste from Eggman's). Even Sonic Rush managed to get this right, where Blaze is not as fast as Sonic, but she has better aerial movement and can jump higher, meaning she's better suited for taking the upper routes during gameplay.

As for Silver.. I dunno.. Silver's character can be summed up with the simple phrase of 'squandered opportunity'. It doesn't help that he debuted in one of the worst Sonic games of all times, with THE worst writing, to boot. The character had a lot going for him, only to have it sullied by being written as a whiny, naive idiot and unplayable (not just for him, the whole thing was unplayable) gameplay. To make matters worse they threw Blaze in because '06 was going to be a reboot of the franchise, and thus a genuinely good character, who had proven herself to be a great asset, was dragged down with him (though thankfully Sonic Team has outright declared that every Blaze to appear since is from the Sol Dimension, and that '06!Blaze does not exist at all).

Incidentally, the Rivals series has done a decent job of making Silver a lot less grating and obnoxious in his personality - the only problem with that is the fact that rather than putting Silver in a major console release to show this new personality, the Rivals series is a PSP-only deal, which means not a lot of people get to see the better presentation of the character. Heck, Silver in Generations was actually impressive, launching psionic blades, and methodically utilizing the debris to pull off some awesome attacks. But then that left me with the impression of "Now why wasn't he this cool in Sonic '06?", which underlines my point that Sonic '06 was really the worst thing to happen to Silver, as it made a terrible first impression for him.

Quite frankly, I think with the Hedgehog Engine (i.e. Unleashed Day Stages, Colours and Generations' gameplay), they finally have the Sonic gameplay down to pat. And I like that as of Colours they finally brought back Sonic's appropriate 'snarky jerk' personality, and went back to Eggman being a crazy, self-loving coot (Eggman was never the 'Saturday Morning Villain' kind of evil that hates puppies and eats your unhappiness type of villain in the first place - the dude's a narcissist, that's why everything is built in his image in the first place. All Eggman wants is for the whole world to think he's as awesome as he himself thinks he is), so from a storytelling standpoint, they're doing great there as well. Now, this all works great for a game starring Sonic as the main character.. but therein lies the question of what they're going to do if they wanna make any new games with other characters.

Unleashed was the game with the most stark contrast of gameplay styles, and the stages are divided up fairly evenly between Sonic and the Werehog. It also means that they have enough disc space to fit the Hedgehog Engine, and a seperate gameplay engine (like the Werehog's) while still telling a full story and so on.. So I'd say that would be a pretty good idea for future Sonic games. Sonic, plus one. Don't crowd it with multiple characters, or you run into the Heroes dilemma that I mentioned before. Sonic.. and then one more character, preferably one with distinct enough gameplay to warrant them being there. If you're going to have other cast members, relegate them to Support roles. Non-playable, but part of the story in that they interact with our heroes or whatever.

That's my two cents, at any rate.

[Rosewind]

Wow...that was quite a read, Needle! Reminds me of the old SoaH days!

I'd like Sonic to return to the S3-S&K game play. Seriously, use the same engine. Do another game like that. None of the fluff like in the touted episodic blah-ery of Sonic 4. Port over Chaotix, or do a faithful remake. Have any of you seen Sonic Fan Remix? It's short and sweet, but it shows what's possible for a good (and faithful) Sonic game:

[Needlemouse]

lol I just started typing and before I knew it I had that slab of text in front of me. Not bad for a 20 minute off-and-on writeup, I think. ..I could honestly discuss different stuff about this franchise for eons, like how based on Sonic 3's Japanese manual, they had already hinted at the plot of Sonic Adventure - meaning it was only the Western manuals that derped on the series canon.

I doubt we'll ever return to those days of the S3&K era, though, save for on handhelds.. People are always expecting games to advance, and given the amount of flak Mario gets for never evolving past 'New NEW Super Mario Bros. Wii U 5', do you really think Sonic would be able to survive doing the same, given its fanbase? As for the Fan Remix game, at least.. sorta felt kinda 'cluttered' to me.. like there was a bit TOO much going on. I was more excited for Sonic 2 HD.. until the lead programmer was caught leaving viral DRM and spyware in the programming, and then quit, taking all the game code with him, because the rest of the team disagreed with his tactics.

A shame too.. the game looked amazing.

[GreenshotApple]

I love you sonic music those two videos above were awesome btw

[gamerkane]

One thing I really hope they bring back is the option to play as other characters, note I said option and not requirement. The best thing is that if Sega decides to keep the simple story line of "Eggman is bad, he needs to be stopped," then you can just put the others in without needing them. I think that was part of the problem with some of the games was the fact that you HAD to play as the others to get to the end of the story.

[Parker_Izing]

Why can't I put all of my sonic in one frame?

playstation 3, Game Boy, Game Gear and Master System games could not fit...

[Needlemouse]

lol Niiiice. Most of my old Sonic stuff's at my parents' place. I should nab it sometime. ..Speaking of S3&K with Rose, though..

..Man, do I remember playing the thing over and over and over again until I had it down to pat the way this guy does.

[Parker_Izing]

Never kinda liked STI Sonic games, I like more the Japanese made,the 16-bit original Sonic and Sonic CD ironically, Sonic CD in the USA had the only mention of western continuity (a sketchy mention of "Princess Sally" in the manual) and STI planned "Sonic 16" based in SatAM continuity. And even had a microscopic Sally Acorn Sprite in Sonic Spinball, but the most important released bit was in Sonic CD manual. (And you know how much SOJ hates western continuity)

Before disappearing under the Pony Rainboom I had been a big Sonic nut...

(BTW, needlemouse, I know your signature references the ending song in "Sonic CD", and the second quote must be from "City escape"

[Needlemouse]

The funny thing is that for the longest while there were all these false myths about the old games versus the newer games; chief amongst them being that the new games didn't acknowledge any of the older ones - when it turns out that Sonic 3's Japanese manual directly teases and hints at the entire main premise of Sonic Adventure, meaning they already had a pretty solid idea of what the deal with things like Angel Island, the Echidnas, the Master Emerald, and so on.. just, again, Western adaptation derp'd it all. lol

And naw, by the second quote, I'm guessing you're referring to "I'll never look back. I've got no regrets. 'Cause time doesn't wait for me, I choose to go my own way," right? That's Sonic's 'character quote' from the first Sonic Adventure. It's on some of the wallpaper art for Sonic, and I recall it's also in the manual.

[DjDitt0]

I'd say the sonic adventure games were pretty smack dab in between new and old. Let's call them the "middle age"

That, my friend, is what we call the "Green Eyes Era."

[starsprite]

sonic adventure 2 is one of the best mostly because it has chaos

[arrowghost]

My last game I used to play is Sonic 3 & Knuckles and Sonic 3D Blast, not so much after that. But when it comes to TV shows, I got "Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog", "Sonic Underground" and my favorite with deep and canon storylines, "Sonic SatAM".

[Needlemouse]

Well, it's that time in my particular time-zone at least, so let me be the first to say: Happy 22nd Birthday, Sonic!

[SilverSwirl]

A belated happy birthday to Sonic! He's only a year older than me! Well maybe 4 months older...

[Needlemouse]

So while this thread's been fairly dead a while now, there's been a good deal of new news for the blue blur, at least! Namely the upcoming Wii-U title, Lost World:

So far this whole thing is looking pretty good. Lots of old, familiar stuff for the old fans, but at the same time a new and fairly fresh approach to the gameplay. While some might imply that this is a Mario Galaxy ripoff (and true enough, even the creators said a bit of spillage from Galaxy did happen), this game actually takes after the old, cancelled Sega Saturn release Sonic Xtreme in many regards - even down to there being six new monster-villains.

Well, that's my contribution, at least.

[Needlemouse]

Don't care if it's a double-post:

WOOOO!!

[Needlemouse]

Another update, from the Lost World venue:

Freaking. Awesome.

Full level playthrough:

[BabyBlueBunny]

Why didnt i find this thread before?!

Anyway, I miss sonic CD...

[Needlemouse]

It did get re-released and fixed up a while back for Steam.

[BabyBlueBunny]

Yeah, but that thing held my childhood..

SONIC BOOM!

[Needlemouse]

Heh, as my signature (and the song links in my Sonic profile, hah) might suggest, I always preferred You Can Do Anything and Cosmic Eternity.

[BabyBlueBunny]

Hmmm I also do have a liking from those two... but my favorite is Endless Possibility (hey, we have our own opinions )

[Needlemouse]

I think it's a bit difficult to point at one single Sonic song and go 'this one is the all-time bestest foreverest!' lol They're all good, for different moods, different occasions, etc.