Ginger Mint

hi hi Well, Ember Spark isn't in the best position to do much right now, so my post was a little bit on the short side. As we all get ready to leave though, I'll have a little bit more to say.

[colour=#BFBFFF]hi hi[/colour] Ember Spark could feel the shadow creature wither and flee, the darkness lessened, and she could see light again through her still closed eyelids. However, the cold had settled in deep and didn't depart along with the creature. She wasn't quite sure when she'd found her way back to the ground again, she couldn't feel her limbs, all she felt was a dull, hollow sensation when she warily tapped them against the floor. In fact, if it weren't for the vague feeling of pressure coming from her bruised side, she wouldn't have been sure she was laying against the floor at all. There was one thing she knew for sure though. She was shivering. Cold was something that she knew about, that she had experienced before. Ever since going on this journey, she'd invented a dozen new ways to describe different levels of cold. She had observed it, measured it, and touched it, but this was the first time she had truly been it. So even though she was dimly aware that the immediate danger had passed, the part of her that wanted to jump for joy was outvoted by the part that just wanted to curl up into a ball and warm up again. And because of the warmth in her heart and in her friends, she felt safe and content enough to do just that. When she finally felt that it was not too bright to open her eyes again, she slowly widened her eyelids until she was just barely squinting, and looked around the room. The shadow was gone, and Emerath and Pocket Change were still there, seeming no worse for their wear. [colour=#773344]"T-thank you..."[/colour] she managed to say through chattering teeth, though she wasn't quite sure who she was speaking too. To Pocket Change for standing up for them, to Emerath for not giving up, or to the Shadow itself, for finally leaving them alone. Emerath was standing nearby, towering over her, and she was about to ask him for a bit of help in starting a fire with the remains of her engine oil when she noticed the distant look in his eyes. So instead she turned her attention to Pocket Change. [colour=#773344]"Y-you're wrong, you k-know..."[/colour] she started out with a grave tone in her voice and paused until she was sure she had his attention, [colour=#773344]"I-I graduat-ted f-from magic s-school in C-Canterlot-t..."[/colour] but she punctuated the end of her statement with a wink and a goofy little grin.

hi hi starswirlthebearded, the Cutie Mark Crusaders acknowledged that what they did was wrong. There was no point in having someone else come in and repeat that for them as well. They showed that the Cutie Mark Crusaders were sorry for what they did, and then explicitly showed them applying that lesson to future encounters with Diamond Tiara and Silver Spoon. Applejack getting mad at them for causing and then fixing their mistake would have been an excellent example of closing the barn door after the horses have already escaped, though. They had already self punished themselves by taking Babs place. Now, to be fair to the authors, this was a parade float, not a automobile capable of going at highway speeds. I've wiped out on my bicycle going faster than parade floats go, and ended up with just a few bumps and bruises. I've gone sledding down hills roughly as steep as the one in this episode (on a sheet of metal no less, and this float was make mostly of wood and fabric.) and walked away without injury. However, bullying really does kill people in real life. ((edit: If you want really dangerous, how about when Applejack raced in front of a speeding train in Last Roundup? They didn't have to point out that such an action was incredibly dangerous specifically, it was enough to say that Applejack's actions in general had been wrong. Yes, maybe they could have done it better. But I don't think they were being totally irresponsible here, they went out of their way to show that what the CMC's had thought was right was actually very bad. If they were aiming for humiliating, why cause the event to happen at the end of the parade route, at the bottom of a hill, away from all the spectators? The writers were showing that this was a personal attack, and that it wasn't right no matter what the circumstances.)) --- NoGiantRobots1983: Philosophy of strength? This is not My Little Pony: The Will is Triumphant, this is My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic. You say you don't like useless people? Well, I say that nobody is useless. Every single person deserves some basic human dignity and respect. I'd also say it is a mistake to classify people into two groups of "people who let me do what I want," and "useless bureaucrats." Please try to understand that other people have different values and they are no less valid than your own. Anyone who has ever raised children ought to know that helping someone doesn't mean making them useless, because every child needs help. They are dependent on adults to survive learn and grow. Giving them help doesn't make them more dependent, it can help them to become independent. And for kids that don't have any wider experiences beyond their own lives, the things that are happening to them, no matter how trivial they might seem to anyone else, are important to them. Babs Seed was important because she was Applebloom's relative, not because the Cutie Mark Crusaders didn't think they'd fit in without her approval. Applebloom was stuck living with her. Bullying does not "toughen people up," it causes lasting emotional damage. Likewise, any kind of intensely traumatic experience is liable to cause long term harm. If you think that hardship will make people tougher, you only need to look at the problems that war veterans face to realize that is not the case.

hi hi This episode was pure genius. I have to admit, I was worried when the first three episodes of the season were so shallow... Oh Sweetie Belle, how right you are, why does life have to be so ironic? In season 1, the cutie mark crusader episodes were some of the weaker episodes, and now its the one that is actually going for some substance. Sweetie Belle: "Then... why do I feel like crying?" touche. I was going to write up a list of all the things that I loved about this episode, but after reading some of the comments here, I think my time will be better served addressing what has already been said. On the topic of having children tell an adult: This is not just a kids show, this is a family show. Yes, sometimes adults don't help kids when they are being bullied. That is not a lesson for kids, they don't need to be saddled with learned helplessness, that is a lesson for adults. Adults need to realize that kids aren't typically capable of handling these things on their own, and that they can't get help from rational adults, then they will often have no where else to turn but to aggression of their own. You say that some places don't have functioning social networks to help kids? Congratulations, there's a lesson to be learned right there. You can't just sit around and wait for problems to reveal themselves to you, you need to be pro-active. You need to discuss bullying, even when you don't think its a problem. Stop it before it starts, if possible, or intervene before someone gets hurt. On the topic of how the CMC's plan was not just humiliating but outright dangerous: I'm pretty sure that this was intentional. Conflict does tend to escalate as people reciprocate. People will pay the other party back and then some. This is such a huge problem in human civilization that there are entire religions that were founded on ways to avoid this phenomenon and de-escalate aggression. Without conscious effort, people who are abused often become abusers themselves. More than 3 times as likely, in some cases.[1] This episode was about bullying, but it was also about stopping the cycle of violence. They showed that the CMC's were perfectly capable of bullying themselves, just like anyone, and then showed that they were also capable of breaking the cycle, just like anyone. I'm glad they were able to stick with Lauren Faust's vision for the show. - Lauren FaustThe Cutie Mark Crusaders did make a big mistake in this episode, and did something that was potentially dangerous. (though not as dangerous as being hit in the head with an anvil) But they learned from their mistake, and the issue wasn't left hanging. (unlike any of the moral quandaries in the last episode.) 1. Links Between Being a Victim and Becoming a Perpetrator, M. Glasser, I. Kolvin, D. Campbell, A Glasser, I. Leitch, and S. Farrelly, The British Journal of Psychiatry (2001) ((not linked because it covers some not safe for work types of abuse))

hi hi You know, I honestly thought we were going to run... I had a thing prepared for it even. If we're not going to run though, I'm afraid Ember Spark is going to do the only thing she knows how: "act totally reckless." (She's got plenty more where that came from.)

[colour=#BFBFFF]hi hi[/colour] Ember Spark still wanted to run. If she could have seen, she might have pushed Emerath back out the door and all the way up the stairs if she had to. They could have disappeared into any one of the thousands of nooks and crevices left open by shattered stone and gone as dark as those mushrooms they'd all seen before. Fade away only to return again once the danger had passed. She wanted to run, but she couldn't see. She could only feel. She felt the cold rough stone against her legs, its loose fragments sliding away underhoof as she struggled to stand. She felt the shadow creature's presence, it stood out against the chill that surrounded it, growing like wildfire and drawing ever closer. It wasn't drawing closer to her though. Even through the haze of panic, she could feel the resignation in Emerath's voice, and in that moment she thought perhaps she glimpsed the creature's intent as well. [colour=#773344]"No..."[/colour] The refusal that her friend's plaintive words had sparked deep down in her gut roared to life in an instant, and where her words had been filled with uncertainty only a moment before, they now found their way to the tip of her tongue as soon as she thought them. Holding back now would have been too much for her heart to bear. [colour=#773344]"No you don't! Everyone fails, from the mightiest Princess to the humblest street performer, to the living shadows who failed to vanquish their foes and were resigned to remain buried and alone."[/colour] Eyes still shut tight, Ember Spark carefully lifted herself back up on all fours. [colour=#773344]If you wanted something from us, you should have asked. I won't let you take my friend, but its ok, because I have something to share...[/colour] She took a step forward, [colour=#773344]"When someone falls, the nice thing to do is to lend a hoof."[/colour] Then another step forward, moving by feeling alone. Another step closer to the creature, and hopefully between it and Emerath. [colour=#773344]"Maybe it is all pointless in the end, but right now, the experience matters."[/colour] The memory was fresh in her mind. She was back in the feasting hall, the warm comforting air sinking into her cold, tired limbs. She remembered how the smell of garlic, onions and roasted carrots tickled her nose and played counterpoint with a freshly eaten cherry tart. She remembered the pleasantly uncomfortable feeling in her stomach, letting her know she'd eaten a bit too much, and she remembered the honeyed oat bread convincing her to eat a little bit more anyway. In hear heart though, she could still feel the joy of laughter, the welcoming smiles of the griffins around her, and the thrill of dancing with a total stranger. No matter how big her heart swelled she knew it would never by too full... nor would it ever truly be empty. Grabbing hold of that feeling for dear life, Ember Spark stepped into the shadowy tendrils. If that creature wanted feelings, she was going to give it something to remember. --- [colour=#302030]'When you go into the alleyway, the big scary thing hiding in the dark is you.'[/colour]

hi hi I'm just curious if other people have an episode that when they first saw it, they didn't like it, and then later after thinking about it for a while, decided it was pretty good after all? (Or vice versa.) For me, I didn't like A Bird in the Hoof very much, and it wasn't until Hearts and Hooves Day came out that I realized what the episode had actually been about. Everyone was talking about how Hearts and Hooves mentioned death in an episode, and how that was supposedly a new thing and a big deal, but thinking back on it, I remembered several episodes that touched on the subject as well. Thats when I realized what the purpose of A Bird in the Hoof was about. No matter what Fluttershy tried, she couldn't stop the natural life cycle. And even though it went back to life again in this case, the episode was largely about coming to terms with death, and about not blaming ourselves for not having tried harder when there was nothing we could do. Yes, it also was about not taking things that weren't yours, but there was certainly a lot more going on in that episode that didn't need to be there if they were just making a point about theft. It still loses points for not getting the message across as clearly as it could have, but I no longer dislike the episode anymore.

hi hi Inexplicable things do happen often in Friendship is Magic, but usually the writers are pretty good at Lampshade Hanging, when they do. Like when Pinkie Pie miraculously grabs the right book, other ponies ask "How'd you do that?" It helps keep belief suspended when they can acknowledge their own oddities. There were a lot of things in the episode that were not explained, and by itself that might not have been a problem, but when they weren't even acknowledged, its not hard for people to feel like the writers don't think highly of our intelligence. (and its not just a matter of being a show for kids. In my experience, one of the most well used word in a child's vocabulary is often "why?") As for puns, I don't know of any puns that got criticism that didn't deserve it. Las Pegasus for example, wasn't one of Faust's puns, but it lit up the discourse with people eagerly trying to determine which city it was referring to. Aquastria on the other hand is kind of a lame pun because of a few different reasons. It is self referential. Equestria is already a pun, so that makes Aquastria a pun of a pun. Also, by going that extra step, the pony element of the pun was removed entirely. Aqua is a pretty common prefix, which also lacks a sense of cleverness. (On the other hoof, Canterlot, is one of the strongest puns in the series because it draws on a less well known and harder to rhyme gait, and a specific and rarely used but legendary name from history.) Still, I haven't heard any flak about that pun until just now.

hi hi I had another thought about the moral of the "test." It occurred to me that there is a similar situation that lots of people go through all the time. Driving. In the USA anyway, there are over half a million injuries every year due to people being distracted at the wheel, not paying attention to the road, etc. I guess that might be a vague moral of the story, to not let yourself be distracted in such dangerous situations. Unfortunately, there is another driving statistic that ruins it. There are over 100,000 automobile accidents that occur every year because people fall asleep at the wheel, which typically involves people who want to keep their eyes on the road, but are unable to do so, in spite of being perfectly typical humans with fully developed mental capabilities. I dunno, maybe its just a wash. (also... I'm not sure if I like being taken out of my comfort zone. It can be... uncomfortable.)

hi hi Also, it was the only flat land around. Do you want them to trip on a rock and sprain an ankle or something? I feel like I should mention that, even though I've been awfully critical about this episode, a lot of it is just a part of the discussion. With the exception of the test, which truly horrified me, I enjoyed the episode reasonably well. I'd put the rest of the episode on par with Bird in the Hoof maybe. I suspect I must sound like an awfully grumpy curmudgeon by now, but the discussion of the episode sort of has taken on a life of its own, to cover more ground than was actually in the show.

hi hi Fair enough, but how about a similar analogy. What if someone pitched a tent in your walkway? You could walk around the tent every time you go out your front door.

hi hi How fair is it to judge Twilight and Co for their solution? I'd say it is entirely fair. I would expect that, when a plan involves harming someone, that one would at least perform their due diligence enough to take the test themselves and see if they are able to pass. Spike didn't pass the test. Neither is it entirely fair to put all the blame on Pinkie Pie. I find this problem strikingly similar to The Cold Equations, in that there are some very important things that should be considered, but never are. Where did that legend come from? Who goes around telling ponies about something dangerous, and how to get to it, without giving them any kind of proper warning? Ponies obviously knew about it, and even had spells specifically designed for dealing with it. If it was dangerous, why was it not dealt with before? Any one event typically has more than one cause, and more than one person who is responsible for those causes. (See history of unsafe working environments, the responsibility of workers who make a mistake, and the owners who set up the conditions.) If Twilight wanted to avoid responsibility for the solution, why didn't she enlist the aid of Pinkie Pie et al. to help clean up her own mess? --- I fail to see how the mane six's actions are a problem with Over a Barrel. They were a problem, yes, but that is an important lesson for people to learn, that you cannot simply step into other people's problems and solve for them, especially when you have a limited understanding of the whole situation. Especially interpersonal problems. I don't know how many times I saw the same old routine when I was growing up, where two people would be having relationship issues, one of their friends would try to tell them what to do as though they were the undisputed authority on everything, and the whole mess would blow up in everyone's face. I also fail to see how having buffalo in the episode was a bad thing. The writers were very careful about not being offensive to minority groups, and got input from native american groups during the production of the episode to ensure that they didn't mess that up. (If I am to believe my Native American Lit instructor, good representation in media is a positive thing that Native American authors are pushing for.) Bellosh101, how would you feel if someone pitched a tent in your driveway and refused to move? --- There's a lot of similarities in Over a Barrel and Too Many Pinkies, in that the mane six are acting badly at times, but in Too Many Pinkies, there isn't a resolution to it. (At least in my opinion, there wasn't a satisfactory resolution to it.)

hi hi I'm not sure what the problem with Over a Barrel is, I thought it was a fine episode, and I agreed with the revisions that the native american experts sent back for them. Sure the audience is going to care about the mane six more than the characters that were just introduced, and would want the mane six to solve the problem in the end, but part of the point was that the people involved had to want to change. After thinking about it a bit, I think perhaps I know what they were trying to do in Too Many Pinkies. They were trying to make a point about choosing the quick and easy path vs the long and difficult path. The test at the end was maybe supposed to represent having to decide between either instant gratification or difficulty now and greater rewards later. The only problem with this is that many of the Pinkie Pies in the end didn't choose, they were tricked and pressured into failing. If I'm right and that was the point they were trying to make (and Celestia help me, that is the best idea I can come up with,) it would have probably been better if they had given the Pinkie Pie's a conscious choice rather than putting their reflexes to the test. They could have said something like, "You can choose to eat this cake, which will be super fun, and get sent back to the mirror, or you can choose to not have any cake and stay," and then watch as all the fake Pinkie Pie's choose to eat cake.

hi hi Actually, I think Dave Polsky's episodes are deep, although I guess it could possibly be accidental. (I could probably write an entire book about Feeling Pinkie Keen, and if the old posts still exist, you'll see that I already have pages written on it.) There's a lot of stuff going on in this episode that is pretty deep in nature, like Pinkie Pie's existential crisis, the question of what it means to be alive, the dilemma of opportunity cost, the necessarily imperfect state of individuality. Were those clones alive? How do you know if you are real? What if you had done something else at any point ever? If nobody had to make any choices, would we have any differences? Most of the questions are raised briefly and left unresolved though, and perhaps that is the real ironic twist and twisted genius of Dave Polsky, is that this episode suffers from an existential crisis itself. It doesn't know the answer to all of its own questions, and for most of them, it doesn't really try. That approach may work well for zen meditation, but for a narrative -especially one so hyper-charged with humor- they really need a complete story arc. But to be fair to the episode, there was some good characterization. Rainbow Dash wasn't a stereotypical jerk and she got a chance to show off her cool, laid back self. Pinkie Pie had some depth, and if their interactions weren't perpetually cut short by scene changes, I'm sure there'd have been some particularly memorable moments in there. ((In Feeling Pinkie Keen, no matter how much emphasis the voice actors said the word "believe," with, it didn't change the fact that Pinkie Sense is literally science, and that even science requires you to believe in your own perceptions. The brain-in-a-vat problem is something that science can never solve, because it is unfalsifiable. So I guess Dave Polsky has already displayed a penchant for existential quandaries.))

hi hi Dessa, you should be a writer. Also, if you were to make the distinction be about which Pinkie Pie had learned something, you could do away with having Twilight zap them all together. They could have had a scene where the real Pinkie Pie explains to all her clones what she's learned, and after they realize that they'll never be able to be everywhere at once, they could either: disappear in a puff of logic, or one of them could say something like "Then why did you bring us out here in the first place?"in a grumpy voice, and they all go back to the mirrorcle on their own.

hi hi Hooves down, Nightmare Moon. In my opinion, she's easily the most relatable of the villains. Who can honestly say that they've never felt pain and anger at the unfairness of the world around them, and wished for some way to force the world to change? In the end though, the things that will actually change the world for the better are honesty, loyalty, generosity, kindness and laughter.

hi hi Total Eclipse, perhaps when Pinkie Pie first stepped into the mirror, she entered a dreamworld where it was possible for multiple Pinkie Pies to exist simultaneously. And since she didn't get zapped by Twilight, she's still stuck in that dreamworld. Dun Dun Dunnn! I honestly felt a strong emotional connection to that first Pinkie Pie clone. Growing up, I was never the popular one, I never had the best social skills, I was the less important second child, and I sometimes felt like I'd been tossed into this crazy, mixed up world without any clue on how I was supposed to get by. Whatever Twilight's spell did to those clones, I hope that first Pinkie clone is in a better place.

hi hi Its not just you elsporko. As I said, I felt that Twilight's solution was truly terrifying, and I don't think the show would be able to address the moral implications even if it tried. The different Pinkie Pie's though similar to each other, were clearly alive. They could think, reason, feel emotions, talk and learn. As far a slapstick comedy goes, this episode was full of great stuff, and I happily smiled my way through the majority of it. As far as having a lesson though, it did fall short. They spent a lot of time telling us what not to do, "don't do what Pinkie Pie is doing," but the solution for their problem didn't show us what to actually do instead. (In contrast, Ticket Master's resolution for having not enough to go around followed logically from Twilight's struggles throughout the episode.) I felt they did give Pinkie Pie some real depth to her character in this episode, which I really liked. But if you were thinking that Pinkie Pie was shallow, I may have an explanation for why they might -paradoxically- both be true. There are some instances where characters have good lines individually, but they don't add up to a conversation. It is like they are talking past each other, rather than along with each other. They say their piece regardless of what anyone else says. Even if a character has complex motivations and displays emotion, it loses some of its edge when nobody else responds to that. Like when Rainbow Dash says, "Found this one moping around," it would have been a good opportunity for some kind of interaction. (This is something I noticed in The Crystal Empire as well, like when Shining Armor was talking about Cadence when she was standing right there.) (Ironically, I thought one of the best conversations where two characters were actually talking to each other was the part where Pinkie Pie is talking to her first clone, and her first clone is explaining her dilemma about missing the super fun thing at Applesauce's place. Which in turn, made me feel extra bad when Pinkie Pie's first clone got zapped away, because she felt like a real person.) So overall, a lot of good moments, they just maybe need to work a little bit on having them mesh together into a whole. But thats nothing a little imagination can't fix.