Ashton Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 One of my closest friends, in an act of desperation, finally agreed to do a MLP RP with me. She's a fan of animation and a furry, but she's closed minded about anything she's pre-decided is not "good enough" (i.e. she refuses to read ANY comics that arent official Manga because "they're all -horseapples-" (self-censored, emphasis my own, but implied)) She's only agreed to do the MLP RP with me because she is desperate to RP with somone...So, I basically have this one shot to convince her that FiM is different to the old MLP and isn't just a "low-budget mindless girls cartoon" Does anyone have any suggestions on what elements I should throw in? (So far her now-oc-pony just, literally, fell into equestria and Rainbow, AJ, Spike and Twilight are seeing if he's ok... no real plot so far) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosewind Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 Won't it be kind of odd for her to RP without really understanding the content, characters, and locales of FiM? Have her watch an episode or two to get an idea about it, otherwise it's going to be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashton Posted February 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 Oh yes, it's going to be severely awkward, her only exposure to it has been a few random FiM artworks that "invaded" some groups she's in on DA... She's only doing this to gain leverage with me for another RP she's forcing me to do...I'm not trying to turn her into a Brony, there's no hope of that, I'm just trying to convince her that FiM is different from the old MLP and isn't *just* a kiddy show... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheColtofPersonality Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 Just throw in Rainbow Dash kicking a dragon in the nose, and say she is made of awesome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashton Posted February 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 Lol "Time to taste the painbow!" always cracks me up heh and Dashie's already covered how awesome she is several times... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hishtagat Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 I'm not really a roleplayer myself so can't help you with the main question, however I'd like to point something out. You are unlikely to make her less hostile/disapproving towards the series through fan-made content (which RP storylines are). Even if you stick to pristine canon approach, there is still the issue of slight skew towards what the people participating find most appealing. In other words, you are trying to change her mind with things that in fact are not really the show's actual setting but your interpretation of thereof, no matter how accurate.Now, not saying the RP is a bad idea in itself, if both parties enjoy it, it obviously is far from that. But if you really want to correct her misconceptions, a pointed debate might be better, if she's at all a person you can actually discuss with. Worked for most of my social group that really bashed the show with no genuine knowledge of it, at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashton Posted February 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 I really, really, wish she were that reasonable. (At one point in time she was, but as she's gotten older she's gotten more and more closed-minded) As I said, she refuses to read webcomics because the'yre not "Professional Manga" and thus are all "Low quality" (despite the fact one I showed her was actually done by a guy who's now working for DC) one of her first comments on FiM is "It's animated in FLASH, it's not even drawn!" because we all know that art = story... </sarcasm> I tried to throw some bits at her casually (like she changed her hair style and I linked Sweety Belles "I Really Like Her Mane!" --- she refused to even open it, the moment she saw it was MLP she stopped it from loading and closed it.)No, unfortunately, the only way to convince her is to come in under her defenses. She's already unhappy with me for doing this, but if I can present her with believable character who are more-or-less exactly as the show portrays them, I might convince her to at least be neutral towards it, instead of spreading lies about how bad it is... (based on (1) the animation quality, and (2) the "MLP" name) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hishtagat Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 I hear ya, it can be really frustrating to deal with people like that. However, if she is that adamant and biased without any solid information to back up her opinions with, I'm afraid your RP won't exactly get past her defenses. Those kind of people often are, quite frankly, tossing **** at things because they NEED to feel discontented with something, they need to actively oppose things, even at the cost of any sensibility. So keep in mind that there is a good chance she'll just shove fingers in her ears and go "nananana can't hear you" anyway once you two are done.If you don't mind me asking though, how come you are so invested in getting her to be at least indifferent towards the show? Seems like a lot of effort just to convince someone about a hobby that you could just as well not discuss with that person.Also, apologies if this is derailing the thread somewhat but it's sadly best way I can be of help on the subject I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashton Posted February 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 It's scary... you just described a Troll... and that description fits her perfectly now *shudder*Well, thing is this girl is my ex-fiance, I think part of this is residual feelings for her and wanting to make her feel better, happier, etc, ...and also the fact that we've been broken up for pushing 5 years and there is nothing I can do short of moving to the jungles of africa to get away from her... (yep she's even "never going to talk to me again" about 3 times now) She's chided me many many times for my interest in the ponies and been upset when I told her that it's actually changed my life for the better, I just want to show her that it's not the horseapple she thinks it is... but your probably right, I'm probably just wasting my time and in the end will get the, as you put it "nananana can't hear you" reaction... Still, I can hope... (the irony is my other best friend, who's always been into dark depressing gothic stuff, is more than willing to give FiM a chance and is actually eager because he's researched it and seen good things about it!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hishtagat Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 You are very unlikely to convince her of anything if she's exactly the way you describe her to be. As for berating you due to your interests in FiM, I'd say that warrants a slap upside the head rather than any concentrated effort to "fix" her. Pushing your opinion in any way if you are not asked about it is both rude and nosy, and if put together with the other traits of hers that you described, it sounds like a rather unpleasant person really.I know it ain't easy but it's sometimes best to take the moral high ground and just not bother. The more you try to convince her, the worse it will likely get since it's effectively trying to push your opinion, too, no matter how misinformed she might be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice4sugar Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 Well, you can just let her watch one of more adventure paced eps or even better, ep that might be in her character and hope to success the roll. Sadly some people might still hate MLP even if they gave try (My mother while doesn't hate MLP:FIM, she doesn't want to watch it at all).If it won't work... there is always cupc... let's forget about that ^_^'. If it won't work sadly, she will never like MLP:FIS. At least until she will become less closed-minded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashton Posted February 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 it sounds like a rather unpleasant person really.She used not to be, but she's gotten very bitter and sadly troll-like... (not to mention "eliteist" with her 'I only read/watch professional stuff') I thought about inviting her here, but honestly I think she'd either just refuse or would troll... and I dont want to bring in a person like that *sigh* (On the other paw, my gothic vampire friend... I might invite him if he watches and likes the show... hilarious irony imo)I know it ain't easy but it's sometimes best to take the moral high ground and just not bother. The more you try to convince her, the worse it will likely get since it's effectively trying to push your opinion, too, no matter how misinformed she might be.Your probably right, but I'm still going to try with the RP, I probably wont push it further than that... she does *LOVE* to RP though so I'm hoping I might get her willing to watch the show after introducing her to it through RP... though still... *sigh* I'm stuck in a logic circle here lol.Well, you can just let her watch one of more adventure paced eps or even better, ep that might be in her character and hope to success the roll. Sadly some people might still hate MLP even if they gave try (My mother while doesn't hate MLP:FIM, she doesn't want to watch it at all).If it won't work... there is always cupc... let's forget about that ^_^'. If it won't work sadly, she will never like MLP:FIS. At least until she will become less closed-minded.She doesnt live near me anymore so I cant exactly lock her in the room and make her watch it, and unless I can convince her that it's not the same as the old MLP or worse (she actially, I think, feels it's worse due to the FLASH animation style) it wont happen...I'm going to suggest she read My Little Dashie, since it's not set in Equestria, and when she tells me how much she hates MLP I will suggest Cupcakes and/or Rainbow Factory since she likes horror films... sad as it is, she might be more likely to read those... -_-*Your absolutely right, she'll never *like* FiM, I jsut want to get her to realize it's not the same as the old one and stop propegating the lies that it's low-quality, poorly written, girly kiddy-drivvel... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelEagle Posted February 26, 2012 Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 Show her anything even halfway decent from the show. If she doesn't realize that it isn't like old MLP, then the game is over because it is literally that easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashton Posted February 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 Show her anything even halfway decent from the show. If she doesn't realize that it isn't like old MLP, then the game is over because it is literally that easy.Tried. She sees it's FiM and closes it. her opinion apparently is "I've seen fanart, so the series stinks" (I didn't say it was logical, just her opinion) I suppose I could technically splice together a video that started as something else, but I think that's underhanded and would only lower her opinion of me, even if it did trick her into watching... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelEagle Posted February 26, 2012 Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 Then she is hopeless. If she is *that* against the idea of even watching it, then she'll have her factually incorrect opinion for as long as she chooses to hold onto it, regardless of any effort of yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starfox64x Posted February 26, 2012 Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 Hm, so she has little to no knowledge of the show already, is that right? Than you kinda have to start her off from scratch... whatever he character is has to be just as new to the world as she is, either 'a human turned pony and brought to Equestria', or stick with a pony with amnesia. Basically you dont want her character to be expected to know more than she does... When you get to a point where you say something like "Hey i heard Discord disrupted the Zap Apple harvest and threw all the jam at Cloudsdale" She'll be confused out of her mind and lose all interest because you're blabbering on about something she knows nothing about... Start her off slow, explain things one at a time, but try to avoid anything that laready has a lot of backstory to it...What does she already like? she likes animation, so what kind of shows does she already like? try and focus on things similar to that. for example, she likes death note, start with a mysterious murder mystery, she likes Naruto, have some crazy battle with ninja unicorns and whatnot (just thought that Rock Lee could be the only Earth pony since all the other ninja's seem to know some form of magic/jutsu... [/OOC] ) Basically try and think of a story that already related to things she likes... Tell me some things and i'll help you find a story for you two to try out =3Although, in the end, if she's already THAT against it, it might be hard to convert her... but if you must, dont TRY to convert her to liking ponies, just try to weave an interesting story with her, and if she enjoys it, great! maybe she'll do another, maybe she'll grow interested in the world you've introduced to her... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashton Posted February 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 @ steel: That's what I'm afraid of. as I said my only hope is to get her to stop spouting negative lies about the series...@ Starfox64x:The start of it is that one of her characters from a more-or-less-modern-earth literally fell out of a portal in the sky, and the mane 6 (or well 3/6 since 3 arent there) wrongly assume that, since he's now a pony, he simply has amnesia. So they're going to be explaining everything.Tricky, very tricky. She likes either extremely dark (DeathNote, Hellsing, blackbutter, LOVES Trigun) or extremely realistic (Orahn high host club) and very little that could fit into equestria... even ones that I could technically adapt (Melancholy of sizumi harau (sp?)) are not her favorites... really the only thing I can think of that might fit is she used to like Slayers... it doesn't help that I like the other end of 'extreme fantasy' or 'whimsical fantasy' so we have very little in common I can draw from... the one thing that I might do is expand on the Steampunk tech of equestria - she does like steampunk...As I said, not trying to make a brony out of her, that's a fools errand, just trying to get her to stop spreading lies... *sigh* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hishtagat Posted February 26, 2012 Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 As I said, not trying to make a brony out of her, that's a fools errand, just trying to get her to stop spreading lies... *sigh*If someone takes her statements seriously while knowing that she's never watched the series, then they are likely not the kind of people who could ever enjoy the show either, and are just looking for uninformed agreement with their current view of it. Long story short, you gain nothing out of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hishtagat Posted February 26, 2012 Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 Doublepost, gah. I don't see any delete button though. Halp. :< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starswirlthebearded Posted February 26, 2012 Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 @ steel: That's what I'm afraid of. as I said my only hope is to get her to stop spouting negative lies about the series...@ Starfox64x:The start of it is that one of her characters from a more-or-less-modern-earth literally fell out of a portal in the sky, and the mane 6 (or well 3/6 since 3 arent there) wrongly assume that, since he's now a pony, he simply has amnesia. So they're going to be explaining everything.Tricky, very tricky. She likes either extremely dark (DeathNote, Hellsing, blackbutter, LOVES Trigun) or extremely realistic (Orahn high host club) and very little that could fit into equestria... even ones that I could technically adapt (Melancholy of sizumi harau (sp?)) are not her favorites... really the only thing I can think of that might fit is she used to like Slayers... it doesn't help that I like the other end of 'extreme fantasy' or 'whimsical fantasy' so we have very little in common I can draw from... the one thing that I might do is expand on the Steampunk tech of equestria - she does like steampunk...As I said, not trying to make a brony out of her, that's a fools errand, just trying to get her to stop spreading lies... *sigh*Just so you know the production values of most those series are much lower than that of mlp. Professional? I doubt she knows the meaning. Most Anime these days are CG with only a few particular key frames are actually hand drawn. I like Anime as much as the next guy, but to write it off as an unprofessional animation job due to the choice of animation method is ignorant. However, trying to get that through the head of such an Anime fan as your friend is impossible. Anime production teams are notorious for cutting corners, and especially for using seeping shots and close ups so that they don't have to animate as much. Not to mention quality dropping in a lot of series. I actually hate watching Anime for the art anymore because of that. I'll read the manga for the art. There are very few exceptions. Not to mention that none of those are even remotely realistic. The situation is likely hopeless for her though. You can tell her everything I said and she won't listen to a darn thing. She is so locked into the thought that Anime > western animation that she'll likely disregard everything. I know because I used to be like that, until I realized the truth. It is worth noting that I consider the interpersonal relationships in mlp more realistic than most in Anime save a few series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSwirl Posted February 26, 2012 Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 I will freely admit Ashton, I was like the person you are referring to in many ways... Except I performed a Face Heel Turn and now like the show due to Caramel, so it's possible. It will be a long, difficult road though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashton Posted February 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 If someone takes her statements seriously while knowing that she's never watched the series, then they are likely not the kind of people who could ever enjoy the show either, and are just looking for uninformed agreement with their current view of it. Long story short, you gain nothing out of this.given her view that FiM is just "the latest MLP" she may claim she's watched it because "they're all the same" but yes, you have a good point...Just so you know the production values of most those series are much lower than that of mlp. Professional? I doubt she knows the meaning. Most Anime these days are CG with only a few particular key frames are actually hand drawn. I like Anime as much as the next guy, but to write it off as an unprofessional animation job due to the choice of animation method is ignorant.However, trying to get that through the head of such an Anime fan as your friend is impossible. Anime production teams are notorious for cutting corners, and especially for using seeping shots and close ups so that they don't have to animate as much. Not to mention quality dropping in a lot of series. I actually hate watching Anime for the art anymore because of that. I'll read the manga for the art. There are very few exceptions.Not to mention that none of those are even remotely realistic. The situation is likely hopeless for her though. You can tell her everything I said and she won't listen to a darn thing. She is so locked into the thought that Anime > western animation that she'll likely disregard everything. I know because I used to be like that, until I realized the truth.It is worth noting that I consider the interpersonal relationships in mlp more realistic than most in Anime save a few series.lol, yes, isn't is great how in anime you can stop falling (background stops scrolling) because your talking? (not to mention falling 1 or 2 stories can take upto the full 30 minutes thanks to dialog or fighting) or you can be half-way into a car, basically balancing on the door of a convertable, and hold that pose for 5 minutes for a conversation? Animation quality, with a few exception, is relatively low for anime --- I'll be the first to admit I dont watch it for the art (though as I said there are a few exceptions, Hayao Miyazaki's work comes to mind) for me it's all about the serialized plot, one giant story, and the fantasy elements (though now that both are finding their way into more western series...) With her though, your absolutely right, she'll argue about the quality of the art till she's blue in the face because "hand drawn anime" is superior to CGI or live-action... yeah... sure... I've had the argument many times with her that plot > art, but she wont hear it, she'd rather watch a show or play a game with high-quality art (or what she considers high-quality) than a deep and powerful story while I still play ZORK... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashton Posted February 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 I will freely admit Ashton, I was like the person you are referring to in many ways... Except I performed a Face Heel Turn and now like the show due to Caramel, so it's possible. It will be a long, difficult road though.you give me hope, thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSwirl Posted February 26, 2012 Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 I am glad that I could give you hope Ashton. caramel consumed more anime than I have and she loves the show too. She did have to watch the infamous Episode 6 of HSTD to write a review for a website and all the eroge made her extremely angry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starswirlthebearded Posted February 26, 2012 Report Share Posted February 26, 2012 given her view that FiM is just "the latest MLP" she may claim she's watched it because "they're all the same" but yes, you have a good point...lol, yes, isn't is great how in anime you can stop falling (background stops scrolling) because your talking? (not to mention falling 1 or 2 stories can take upto the full 30 minutes thanks to dialog or fighting) or you can be half-way into a car, basically balancing on the door of a convertable, and hold that pose for 5 minutes for a conversation? Animation quality, with a few exception, is relatively low for anime --- I'll be the first to admit I dont watch it for the art (though as I said there are a few exceptions, Hayao Miyazaki's work comes to mind) for me it's all about the serialized plot, one giant story, and the fantasy elements (though now that both are finding their way into more western series...) With her though, your absolutely right, she'll argue about the quality of the art till she's blue in the face because "hand drawn anime" is superior to CGI or live-action... yeah... sure...I've had the argument many times with her that plot > art, but she wont hear it, she'd rather watch a show or play a game with high-quality art (or what she considers high-quality) than a deep and powerful story while I still play ZORK...That is just it... Most anime is NOT hand drawn anymore, except for a few key frames. The rest is done by COMPUTER. I really wish I could drive that into the minds of anime fans. In any given episode of anime, you might see only 10 hand drawn frames of thousands. It is far too expensive to have hand drawn animation anymore. And for anime, that nearly died in the 90s and was saved by American and Canadian licensing companies, they would not waste money on doing hand drawn animation. It looks like it is hand drawn likely because of the key frames, but in reality it is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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