Your True Opinions on the Hatedom

[SirShadowdeath]

Whether by fate or not, It always seem like I end up sering many, many, many situations of hate against Bronies and MLP FiM. Now, this is not a hate thread. This is not a complaint thread. This is a discussion thread on opinions and beliefs.

Now, as I had stated, I've seen many instanced of hate. Whether it be fights in Youtube comments or stereotypical common trollling, you must admit that it's in a lot of places. I personally have to a long conclusion on the fandom, fans, and haters. And those who are neutral.

The following may be tl;dr.

Hate is always existant. Let's face it. As much as we try and try, it'll always be there. Now, people make fun of Bronies and Fans because they like a show originally targeted at little gorls. Now, I can understand this. As once said, if you were suddenly introduced to a group of people who liked a show made for little children, you would have odd first impressions. This I don't mind. It's inevitable. Now, there's a large difference between intolerance and confusion. Confusion would be seeing this "fad" (as I shall call it for now) and just being like "lol wut? U crazy!". Intolerance is different. Intolerance would be seeing this and immeditaly jumping to hateful and irrational conclusions. I wouldn't expect any less of humanity. But how does this relate to the situation? Well, I'm getting there. Let's use some theories and logic for awhile. Let's say there's a group of 100 people (gender dosen't matter at the moment). Out of this 100, 20 people (20%) are bronies or fans. The rest are not. Continuing, let's say 20 people (20%) have been introduced to the concept but don't like it. They are tolerant though. Then, there's 55 (55%) who are intolerant. And of course the remaining 5% have never heard of the concept. By "popular demand", or what I'm calling biased misinformation, they would most likely convert to intolerant. This would be by bandwagon of course. If hate is popular, it would take a strong person to join the opposing side. Now, back on the main topic, I would like to continue on. It would also appear a lot of this hatred stems from two topics: misinformation and misconception. Both of these stem off of an original source, which can relate back to bandwagon. Now, misinformation is a popular idea. This happens a lot. A lot. Whether it's Fix News reporting on Bronies as pedophiles and gay men or people spreading rumours, it's bound to happen. But misconception is something else. It is the mistake in notion, or in this case a false sense of biase or hate. This tends to happen to due biased views (all homosexuals are stupid, etc). A good example of this is calling something stupid gay. That's just idiotic when you think about it. We all (most of us;a good majority from statistics) do this. What does this relate back to? Bandwagon! It all has to come from an original source. A baby does not prosper on it own, an environment must be provided. Now, continuing on. People also have these notions because of stereotypes. This is where it becomes more difficult. There is a certain percentage of bronies that enjoy pony based porn and pony based violence and gore. I'm quite sure the porn goes over much worse. When people see a percentage, it becomes a stereotype. It would be like saying every american is obese and racist. Prime example. People say this all the time, whether jokingly or not. Is it true? No! Have you seen America? Now, this might be a tough comparison because America could be seen easier than a brony community. In a community, a percentage obey a stereotype. But not all of us. A lot of hate is started because of the misconception of stereotypes being reality. Which is understandable, but it's moronic when you think about it. It's not just the fault of haters though. It's partly the fault of extremist fans for having such mean, rebellious "wars" against haters. I mean, look at the 4chan MLP cancer war. A prime, prime example. The war started because of the enforcement of a subject onto a group of people. Therefore, another misconception was made. One was to the "haters", which was all fans were extremists. Another was to the "Bronies", that all haters were the same or similiar.. Are there extremists? Yes. It's inevitable. There always will be. Am I surprised at the hate? No. I don't expect anything less from humanity. It just frustrates me to see people calling us pedo's and gay's. It's frustrating, but there's really no way to bring it to an end. I could sit here and write pages and oages and pages and pages of paragraphs and theories about hatedom, fandom, and communal problems. But I won't. Because I'm sure no one wants to hear me babble.

Now that you've heard (parts of) my opinion, what's yours?

Are the haters butthurt?

Are they scared to like something odd?

Are they on the bandwagon?

I'd like to know your opinions.

(I'm sincerely sorry for any misinformation. It's about 11:00 PM and I'm a tad tired. )

[SteelEagle]

My opinion is that hate is something all groups must deal with. For the majority of groups the amount of hate is equal to the both the size and decibel level of the fanbase. In other words, most hate you will deal with online is bandwagon. A smaller subsect will be the ignorant, and yet another small group may have legit beef- like with bronies pushing FiM on the unwilling like a zealot pushing faith on an atheist. These cases are well known and are quite disadvantageous as they create hate.

In the end, though, hate is hate and will exist. Ignorance is ignorance and will always remain so. Do not pay heed to the foolish and ignorant and attempt to engage them in anything resembling a fight, since the entrenched fool is a decidedly more dangerous one. Ignore and push on, and then the hate becomes a matter of laughter rather than a point to battle.

[Guest EoLPinkie]

Angry ponies bother you? I feel sorry for them. They don't have super special pony happiness in their hearts. Really, it's hard enough for ponies I actually meet every day to hurt my feelings or make me feel bad. Good luck to ponies I meet on the Internet! I just think they're either afraid or want to seem cool. Which is silly, coolness comes from inside ponies, not from other ponies!

[Dovahshy]

The main issue with the people against the fandom, (as with all racist or sexists etc..) is that they are not open minded. They are afraid of change. Take the example of the 4chan war. When the brony community first stemmed out from within its depths, people were scared (according to a report on the subject of internet sociology) of the ponies. They promoted peace, harmony, and especially tolerance and love. They went to /b/ to be dirty, to indulge the darker part of the mind. 4chan was a place where things like hate and intolerance and the simple fun of chaos could be expressed. Their minds were very open to this; human nature, unfortunately is more darkly aligned. Then, the bronies stemmed up, and they embraced it, being from the /b/ board. When they saw that they were letting this new idea into their internet lives of their own free will, they started to close their minds. The open minded left and took the ponies with them. Now we have an amazing fanbase, and we now have a huge chunk of the internet, where good is promoted. The problem, to me isn't intolerance, its just about people who aren't open minded,

[weesh]

A well organized Hatedom is fun. It isn't my cup of tea, but I can see the draw. It is exciting when the members consume all the material in order to more effectively rip it to shreads. As far as I can tell, they consider themselves the voice of reason. And they are not wholely wrong. Nor are they all closed minded.

[DashieInTheDark]

Ah, you see. This is a very bad topic to chat about, because of ONE simple factor.

We do not have ALL the points of view here.

You're on this forum, meaning you enjoy the show. Anyone on this forum enjoys the show, or at least what has come from the fanbase. Either way, everyone here likes something related to FiM.

In order for a topic like this to be thoroughly discussed, we would need someone who seen it, but doesn't like it, a hater, someone who loves it ,and someone who's never seen it. (Or a few of them) to completely debate this topic. We can't talk about WHY the "hater" group hates it, because we're not a part of it. I do see your point, and besides a few grammatical errors, you were spot on. I'm not just going to say "Hate always exists" because that's obviously known here.

The idea of "bandwagon" is true, but ONLY to those that have NOT watched at least an episode of the show. For those that HAVE seen it, and can legitimately form an opinion, they should not be considered "bangwagoners" from the beginning. Of course, if they HAVE seen it, but start flame wars, and troll about it, they're considered haters. (Read on to understand)

Rather, they are in their own group. Once they've watched it, they go "up a level" so to speak. Where if they don't care for it, they're neutral. If they hate it, they hate it. NOT "haters" because if you don't like it, you're not a "hater" only someone who HATES it from the start without giving it a chance. And of course, there's bronies in there too. You have to remember this.

All of the "haters" hate it to be cool. There are no exceptions. You're not getting rid of it by hating it, you're not making the brony fandom decrease, you're not having any affect on it. Now, these are not to be confused with the ones that just "really dislike it", either. I mean the ones who will flame bronies, spam their threads, and get pissed off very easy at the first sight of it. If you legitimately HATE the show, you're not a "hater" you just dislike it severely. Someone who cannot stand a vegetable, isn't a "hater" of that vegetable, is he? Someone who constantly rants ABOUT the vegetable, would, however, BE a hater. The problem with the Youtube comment wars, is that ,why are the "haters" going to the videos in the first place? to start a flame war, to be cool, to troll, etc. They're trying to impress their online pals. Which never really works, to be honest. Of course, this holds true to every "fandom" not just FiM's fanbase. There's nothing you can do except keep converting people, and decrease the SIZE of the haters. They will always be there, but will very slowly decrease over time for each fandom, as they get bored and give up. THIS WILL ONLY HAPPEN IF you ignore them, though. You cannot argue with them, continue their flame wars, or fall victim to their "trolls".

I think that's enough for now.

[Ashton]

I'm going to break this down to give my view.

Bronies have several things going against them from the start:

1. MLP was a "Girls Show" (and to some minor extent still is)

2. MLP is a "Cartoon" so it's obviously "just for kids" (cross-reference the "Animation Age Ghetto")

3. It's Ponies, who are animals, meaning were obviously "all perverted furries"

4. It's a "happy" series (compared to, say, everything on showtime...)

5. it's a "silly" series (compared to anything that's not a sitcom)

Personally I see #1 and #3 as the biggest offenders. the #2 "Cartoon" argument is dieing with shows like "The Simpsons", "Family Guy, and "South Park" that are animated "Cartoons" for adults, not to mention Anime is becoming bigger in the west now, though it has it's own share of problems (and I wont go into the furry "cult" series that nobody who's not neck-deep in the fandom knows about --- but there are some that are adult-oriented), and #4 and #5 is a matter of personal taste (look at how popular sitcoms are - most of them arent "dark" or "serious") though again, 2, 4, and 5 are major issues still, just not as major as 1 and 3.

Coming from the Furry Fandom (and still a proud Furry I might add) I can see how it's less than a good group to associate with because it's wide open (in all manners of the term) and there are PLENTY of "adult content" sites and furs. Lots of people think "ponies are animals, therefore all the bronies are furries" which while is *technically* accurate (Furry is a love of "anthropomorphic animals" so, yes, ponies fall in there, so does Bugs Bunny, Sonic the Hedgehog, and even Snoopy) Most of the bronies are not furries by association (Not going to go into this, that's a whole topic in and of itself) However, the association is there and causes a lot of friction since there is no obvious "badge" people display saying they're not furries.

#1 has been covered and re-covered so many times it's not funny. A very girls-oriented, kiddy-oriented show was severely retooled, and people are still left with their first impressions from prior MLPs (I admit I had the same problem - one reason I didn't get into it until ~6th epp of S2 had aired) This is a legitimate issue since this is the 5th series of the franchise (counting Gen 3.5 as a separate series, which, someone correct me if I wrong, it essentially was) it's hard to believe a franchise will radically deviate from it's established pattern (and had it not been for Faust it probably wouldn't have)

Beyond this is the age old marketing problem of "word of mouth" one bad word weighs as heavy as a dozen good ones. If your friend says "I like this show" then you will likely check it out, and if he says "I hate this show" then you likely wont because you trust your friend, and you will spread that opinion untill you form your own (which may never happen if you decide not to watch the show)

These are the "legitimate" problems. Trolls of course will pounce on ANYTHING that doesn't fit THEIR definition of "good programming" or a "good culture" but I think I can sum it up with a simple meme "Trolls gonna troll"

[weesh]

Ah, you see. This is a very bad topic to chat about, because of ONE simple factor.

We do not have ALL the points of view here...

All of the "haters" hate it to be cool. There are no exceptions...

Sure it is unlikely that we have any haters on this forum, but I was involved with two other hatedoms, and got to interact with them at a personal level. Both were full of logical and normal people who debated and discussed just like we do. They had chat forums that had nothing to do with the theme of their communities, and they occassionally had admiration for something that the creators did right. Furthermore, many of them were fans at some point during the run, and fell away for some reason or the other, but still feel emotionally invested in the work.

Personally, I have not see any of the hatedom for MLP, but I find it hard to believe that ALL of it is as negative and unproductive as you guys are making it out to be. I don't like MLP to be cool. I like it because it makes me happy to be in a community with people that have similar interests as myself. Hatedom communities can be the same.

[DashieInTheDark]

Sure it is unlikely that we have any haters on this forum, but I was involved with two other hatedoms, and got to interact with them at a personal level. Both were full of logical and normal people who debated and discussed just like we do. They had chat forums that had nothing to do with the theme of their communities, and they occassionally had admiration for something that the creators did right. Furthermore, many of them were fans at some point during the run, and fell away for some reason or the other, but still feel emotionally invested in the work.

Personally, I have not see any of the hatedom for MLP, but I find it hard to believe that ALL of it is as negative and unproductive as you guys are making it out to be. I don't like MLP to be cool. I like it because it makes me happy to be in a community with people that have similar interests as myself. Hatedom communities can be the same.

I'm not disagreeing with you, by no means am I. I just can't see what the POINT OF a group getting together to HATE something is. If a group is together, they can have fun, no matter what it is. I just don't understand why. It's sort of the "Anti-matter" effect to bronies. The "Anti-bronies" if you will. I know they exist, I just, I dunno. The time you spend HATING something could be spent liking something. If you're that devoted to hating something, why not be devoted to something that you enjoy instead? When a group of people agree on something, the moral level is usually generally high. So they feel better, just like bronies do, in the reverse situation. (When we LIKE something) I just don't see why people want to spend so much time hating something, but not doing the same with things that they do enjoy.

[DashieInTheDark]

I'm not disagreeing with you, by no means am I. I just can't see what the POINT OF a group getting together to HATE something is. If a group is together, they can have fun, no matter what it is. I just don't understand why. It's sort of the "Anti-matter" effect to bronies. The "Anti-bronies" if you will. I know they exist, I just, I dunno. The time you spend HATING something could be spent liking something. If you're that devoted to hating something, why not be devoted to something that you enjoy instead? When a group of people agree on something, the moral level is usually generally high. So they feel better, just like bronies do, in the reverse situation. (When we LIKE something) I just don't see why people want to spend so much time hating something, but not doing the same with things that they do enjoy.

A few minutes after posting this: I realized.

Maybe the haters aren't exactly "haters" but rather, they enjoy being in a community together ,"hating" on something. Of course, this applies to the ones that keep their hate away from the other part of the fandom. But I think that a lot of haters enjoy hating something, if enough of them are in a group. SO really ,they aren't much different than bronies. They just really dislike it, rather than really like it.

[Rosewind]

I see two distinct elements in this pony "hatedom" that you're talking about. The first -- and probably most important -- is the point that Lauren Faust points out in this reply on DA:

She's basically saying that the haters (most of them presumably young or middle-aged males) were raised to dislike anything feminine, and the intolerance that we see is a product of that. Bronies are the antithesis of the expectation that males should shun anything girly, and reienforces that girly things can, in fact, be pretty fun and cool, and it makes the "hatedom" very uncomfortable because they were raised to behave that way.

The other element I'm speaking about is the fact that people can anonymously say whatever they want on the internet. I'd really like to see any one of them walk into a pony gathering in real life and start laying down hate and rude comments. Some of them might, but I'm going to assume a lot of them are cowards that only have something to say behind a computer screen.

The delight in all this is that all of the hateful stuff is easily avoidable, and most of it (that I've seen) is really only centered around a few internet hot spots, like chan boards.

[weesh]

I'm not disagreeing with you, by no means am I. I just can't see what the POINT OF a group getting together to HATE something is...I just don't see why people want to spend so much time hating something, but not doing the same with things that they do enjoy.

I disengaged from both hatedoms because as much fun as the were, at their core, they were a little depressing.

Maybe the haters aren't exactly "haters" but rather, they enjoy being in a community together ,"hating" on something. Of course, this applies to the ones that keep their hate away from the other part of the fandom. But I think that a lot of haters enjoy hating something, if enough of them are in a group. SO really ,they aren't much different than bronies. They just really dislike it, rather than really like it.

I agree. "hatedom" may be the easiest lable, but it is also a misnomer. "Hate" is way too strong a word to describe everyone in these communities.

[Halide]

There is, with any group that happens to enjoy something, some group that hates them for having what could generally be called 'fun' or 'a good time' or 'satisfaction with their current lifestyle'. There is hatred for people who like well-voice-acted, colourful talking pastel ponies. There is hatred for people who enjoy the times, life and exploits of a billionaire who defeats crime with an endless array of gadgets and wits. There is hatred for people who enjoy a series set a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away. There is hatred for people who enjoy the merriment of talking, bouncing, singing vegetables. There is hatred for people who recognize and accept the theory that small mutations found within a family of species may lead to a long series of advancements in the biology of that genus. There is hatred for people who feel that the use or consumption of animal products is unecessary for their continued living. There is hatred for people who enjoy a series of panels accompanied by words, concerning the exploits of children playing a supra-universal game of creation and exploration. There is hatred for people who would rather imagine themselves as a species or genus other than what they were born with. There is hatred for people who are attracted to their own gender. There is hatred for the number 42. There is hatred for mathematics. There is hatred for history. There is hatred for political beleifs.

No matter where you look, wherever there is a group of people having fun in sufficient quantity to be seen and recognized by those not within that group, there is going to be a much smaller, much angrier group of people who decide to hate, berate, aggrivate, exclude, slander, illegalize, dehumanize, defenstrate, deface, discredit, attack, or otherwise try to make miserable the people having fun.

As such, I will leave it to spiderman to convey my feelings upon this matter.

[knight]

I see two distinct elements in this pony "hatedom" that you're talking about. The first -- and probably most important -- is the point that Lauren Faust points out in this reply on DA: She's basically saying that the haters (most of them presumably young or middle-aged males) were raised to dislike anything feminine, and the intolerance that we see is a product of that. Bronies are the antithesis of the expectation that males should shun anything girly, and reienforces that girly things can, in fact, be pretty fun and cool, and it makes the "hatedom" very uncomfortable because they were raised to behave that way. The other element I'm speaking about is the fact that people can anonymously say whatever they want on the internet. I'd really like to see any one of them walk into a pony gathering in real life and start laying down hate and rude comments. Some of them might, but I'm going to assume a lot of them are cowards that only have something to say behind a computer screen. The delight in all this is that all of the hateful stuff is easily avoidable, and most of it (that I've seen) is really only centered around a few internet hot spots, like chan boards.

Liked for having a high-value post. I don't give those out willy-nilly.

That being said, my opinion on the matter is that no matter how you look at things--how you look at any 'fandom', there are people who will just never BE part of that fandom, and people who will have a hatred for that fandom, and that both things often stem from ignorance. I think more and more people are getting curious about ponies, but there are the obstinate people that no matter even if they were the 1% that DIDN'T like it, there opinion would NEVER change. They hate it JUST to hate it. Just to be against something.

There are often times where I think that people just NEED to hate. And people that fall into prejudicing against whatever is deemed 'different' at a young age get only worse as they get older, and then....high school. Then they become the nasty jocks and bullies that destroy nerds and push sophomores to suicide, and make fun of kids for playing video games, being chubby, or even being smart. Nothing is going to change them, even after they graduate. In my opinion, these people are ADDICTED to hate. The uprising of something new and different, where normal non 'haters' are disliking it because it is difference, empowers these 'hate-addicts' to fuel the flames of hate, and try and make themselves feel more in control of whatever it is that's different, and also of all those who's dislike are fueled to hatred.

It always stems from someone severe, twisting the opinions of others. Whether it's the media or a single anon on 4chan, there's always some sort of 'ringleader' who this can be traced to--again, in my own opinion.

I truly believe that responding to haters with flame wars and snarls only furthers the rage and hatred between the haters and the fandom. I firmly believe in the response of 'love and friendship'. Smother them with kindness.