Magic the Gathering Libraries(decks) discussion

[weesh]

Well, here's the first iteration of a new budget deck concept I've been working on: http://www.mtgvault....x?DeckID=358448

The idea is to overwhelm your opponent(s) with excessive drawing and discarding. Kederekt Parasite, the enchantments, Runeflare Trap, and Molten Psyche are the main win conditions, with Obstinate Familiar, Sangromancer, and the rest of the deck providing survivability and utility.

There are a lot of cards that I love in this deck. Spiteful Visions for instance is one of my favorite cards.

I think you have two decks working at cross purposes. A draw deck and a discard deck.

One of the best uses of discard is depriving them of resources, but when you also make them draw, it loses its effectiveness.

Sure, the two sides go beautifully with Molten Psyche, but you just won't deal damage to them fast enough to stay alive. Currently liliana's caress' only point is for 6 powerful spells, which is not enough. You need to design the deck around the caress, or take it out. I'd say take it out because if you add spiteful visions instead, you will be doing a similar amount of damage AND furthering your other goals. They also stack with each other, and provide a consistent source of damage. In my draw decks, everyone has a hand full of cards, but they cannot leverage the advantage because they cannot cast them fast enough.

Staying alive will be a problem since you are without much defense. My visions deck struggles to stay alive, even when I splash green or white for powerful defensive cards. There is no way that you can splash a color, because you mana requirements are extreme. You have a card that costs BBB, and also a card that costs 1RR. I don't think you can afford to play underworld dreams. Fortunately, Spiteful Visions is easier to cast. Don't play less than four visions; it is the best card in this deck. The molten psyche is fun, but you may have trouble with metalcraft with only 12 artifacts, including 8 lands. These lands are a severe liability. When I play them they are often frustrating because they are easy to kill. I might recommend something like steel wall to provide you with early defense and some additional artifacts. If you have a wheel of fortune, it goes beautifully in this deck.

[Ciraxis]

Well, here's the first iteration of a new budget deck concept I've been working on: http://www.mtgvault....x?DeckID=358448

The idea is to overwhelm your opponent(s) with excessive drawing and discarding. Kederekt Parasite, the enchantments, Runeflare Trap, and Molten Psyche are the main win conditions, with Obstinate Familiar, Sangromancer, and the rest of the deck providing survivability and utility.

Interesting...it reminds me heavily of Ebony Owl Netsuke deck....Owl itself, Font of Mythos, Black Vise and Mikokoro from it can be

alternatives.

Maybe Tibalt? Or Adamaro, First to Desire? Or Gaze of Adamaro?

[TrinalHeart1103]

2nd Iteration: http://www.mtgvault....x?DeckID=358448

I ended up completely removing the discard aspects of the deck, and added a few new cards. Ivory Tower is a great one drop artifact in this deck, as ideally I'll be gaining at least 3 life a turn with it. Slagstorm is a pretty great 3 CMC card that can cover this deck's inherent weakness to aggro.

[weesh]

Ah, slagstorm is a good idea, and could even be used as a finisher.

But I'm starting to feel bad about Sangromancer now, since it has a toughness of 3. Consider Demigod of revenge in it's place. The demigod survives slagstorm, can punch through the last five damage out of nowhere (or 5 of the last seven if you have the visions in play, so they will lose during their draw phase), and the recursion makes it an efficient blocker of many types of attackers. I'd put four in if you can afford it, because it is a powerful card. I use Rumbling Slum in my G/R version of the deck, and it is amazing what even a ground-pounder can do to put pressure on your opponent when they are trying to survive a visions.

How do you feel about the burning inquiry? It obviously fits the deck, but the random discard seems pretty harsh on yourself, and I don't like including cards with card disadvantage unless they are amazing. Seems like lightning bolt might be better here.

Could you also remind me if this is for duels or multiplayer? It seems like a multiplayer deck, but I agree with black vise if it is for a duel.

[MakosMIchio]

Hey guys made this deck a couple weeks ago in anticipation of orzhov

It's a white / black spawning and life drain.

Creatures

Midnight duelist (2)

Angelic wall (2)

Highborn ghoul (2)

Manor skeleton (2)

Vampire nighthawk (2)

Slayer of the wicked (2)

Bloodline keeper (2)

Serra angel (2)

Mikaeus, the lunarch (1)

Artifacts

Bladed bracers (4)

Conjurer's closet (2)

Non creature

Duress (2)

Ghoulcaller's chant (2)

Disentomb (2)

Undying evil (2)

Skeletal grimace (2)

Sign in blood (2)

Victim of night (4)

Safe passage (2)

Triumph of cruelty (2)

Angel's mercy (2)

Curse of exhaustion (2)

Cathar's crusade (3)

Increasing ambition (2)

Exquisite blood (1)

Killing wave (1)

Lands

Plains (13)

Swamps (13)

This deck is still in testing but from all the other proto-decks I pitted against it seems to work accept against the mill deck I have been building up on sense world wake.

I do plan on removing the bracers for 2 rings of thune and 2 rings of Xathrid. I will also add more killing waves and exquisite bloods and possibly swap mikaeus for the orzhov guild leader when it comes out.

[Ciraxis]

Hey guys made this deck a couple weeks ago in anticipation of orzhov

It's a white / black spawning and life drain.

Creatures

Midnight duelist (2)

Angelic wall (2)

Highborn ghoul (2)

Manor skeleton (2)

Vampire nighthawk (2)

Slayer of the wicked (2)

Bloodline keeper (2)

Serra angel (2)

Mikaeus, the lunarch (1)

Artifacts

Bladed bracers (4)

Conjurer's closet (2)

Non creature

Duress (2)

Ghoulcaller's chant (2)

Disentomb (2)

Undying evil (2)

Skeletal grimace (2)

Sign in blood (2)

Victim of night (4)

Safe passage (2)

Triumph of cruelty (2)

Angel's mercy (2)

Curse of exhaustion (2)

Cathar's crusade (3)

Increasing ambition (2)

Exquisite blood (1)

Killing wave (1)

Lands

Plains (13)

Swamps (13)

This deck is still in testing but from all the other proto-decks I pitted against it seems to work accept against the mill deck I have been building up on sense world wake.

I do plan on removing the bracers for 2 rings of thune and 2 rings of Xathrid. I will also add more killing waves and exquisite bloods and possibly swap mikaeus for the orzhov guild leader when it comes out.

Hmmm? It's supposed to be Standard legal I assume? Where is Elite Inquisitor then? Sorin and new Ajani could also find their place.

[weesh]

I had to look up a lot of those cards.

• If a deck has 70 cards, it has 10 too many. Take out 8 spells and 2 lands, which will leave you with 40% mana sources. You have many sub-optimal cards in this deck, and they are reducing your chances of drawing the strong cards like Mikaeus and Bloodline Keeper. I can think of about 30 of your cards that I would swap out for the guild leader (as far as I can tell, they never said the promo would be a guild leader) rather than Mikaeus.
  
• If you cannot afford any of the good dual lands, try adding four Orzhov Basilica's in place of some plains and swamps. They are slow, but strong and cheap.
  
• If a deck consistently loses to a mill deck (unless it is a combo deck like grindstone/painters servant) it is too slow.
  
• The deck has an uncomfortably large number of cards that cost BB. In a two color deck with no dual lands, you are very likely to play inefficiently or miss card drops.
  
• The deck needs more creatures (or leave in all the creatures and take out 8 non-creature spells), and fewer creature recursion cards. Four is too many in this deck. Don't play cards like Cathar's Crusade unless your deck is stuffed full of creatures.
  
• Conjurer's Closet is a bad card in this deck. The only purpose I can see is to bounce the Slayer of the wicked. That is the only creature I see with an Enter the Battlefield ability, and while it is powerful, it is situational, since it blanks against decks that the slayer can't hurt.
  
• Exquisite Blood and Angel's Mercy are bad cards. Life gain is bad most of the time. You are better off playing a creature that makes you competitive than trying to fight the loss of life with life gain.
  
• Triumph of Cruelty wants to be played in a deck with big creatures, or at least consistently midrange creatures, and that is not the case with this deck.
  

[Ciraxis]

I had to look up a lot of those cards.

• If a deck has 70 cards, it has 10 too many. Take out 8 spells and 2 lands, which will leave you with 40% mana sources. You have many sub-optimal cards in this deck, and they are reducing your chances of drawing the strong cards like Mikaeus and Bloodline Keeper. I can think of about 30 of your cards that I would swap out for the guild leader (as far as I can tell, they never said the promo would be a guild leader) rather than Mikaeus.
  
• If you cannot afford any of the good dual lands, try adding four Orzhov Basilica's in place of some plains and swamps. They are slow, but strong and cheap.
  
• If a deck consistently loses to a mill deck (unless it is a combo deck like grindstone/painters servant) it is too slow.
  
• The deck has an uncomfortably large number of cards that cost BB. In a two color deck with no dual lands, you are very likely to play inefficiently or miss card drops.
  
• The deck needs more creatures (or leave in all the creatures and take out 8 non-creature spells), and fewer creature recursion cards. Four is too many in this deck. Don't play cards like Cathar's Crusade unless your deck is stuffed full of creatures.
  
• Conjurer's Closet is a bad card in this deck. The only purpose I can see is to bounce the Slayer of the wicked. That is the only creature I see with an Enter the Battlefield ability, and while it is powerful, it is situational, since it blanks against decks that the slayer can't hurt.
  
• Exquisite Blood and Angel's Mercy are bad cards. Life gain is bad most of the time. You are better off playing a creature that makes you competitive than trying to fight the loss of life with life gain.
  
• Triumph of Cruelty wants to be played in a deck with big creatures, or at least consistently midrange creatures, and that is not the case with this deck.
  

This. And Orzhov will appear in Gatecrash so you have to wait quite a while.

[MakosMIchio]

I know orzhov is in gatecrash, and it is a work in progress. I use the exquisite blood in combo with killing wave so even if I lose life I will gain what ever my opponent loses. I am going to replace Slayers with blood hunter bats. I will replace the triumphs with Elixers of immortality. I may bring in some Chronomations and Primal clays, but I am keeping my nighthawks no matter what you guys say they are fun and cool. Plus I do not have a stable source of income to buy planes walkers like Sorin or ajani.

[MakosMIchio]

I may put 2 or 3 of each new black and white knights in the deck as well.

[weesh]

I use the exquisite blood in combo with killing wave so even if I lose life I will gain what ever my opponent loses. I am going to replace Slayers with blood hunter bats. I will replace the triumphs with Elixers of immortality. I may bring in some Chronomations and Primal clays, but I am keeping my nighthawks no matter what you guys say they are fun and cool.

If the primary purpose of the singleton exquisite blood is to combo with the singleton killing wave, then you should take out the exquisite blood. Combos like this are cool, but it is not that much more powerful than just the wave, and you just won't reliably get the both of them together. Also, the best combos are those whose component parts are good. Killing wave is a beater, even on its own, but the EB will be bad most of the time. A more reliable combo is with blood artist, which is also good on it's own. It has better synergy with the killing wave too, since they will lose life for all of their creatures, not just the ones they decide to keep.

How about just take out the triumphs, and forget about the elixers? LIFE GAIN IS NOT GOOD. And the reshuffle function isn't a good strategy most of the time. Rather than trying to survive a mill deck, you should be designing a deck to beat down someone who is wasting their time milling you.

Who said anything about taking out nighthawks? They are some of the best cards in your deck. Do you have more?

I may put 2 or 3 of each new black and white knights in the deck as well.

I like those. It is good to have more cheap and efficient creatures that are easy to cast. Protection is relevant as well, since it is not clear what your strategy is for punching thought damage if they stabilize. Don't just add them though; take out your less efficient spells to make room for them.

Again, is this for a duel against one other person, or a multiplayer match with at least three people?

Aside: I once played a guy who had singleton crypt rats, darksteel plate and lifelink in a deck. All of these cards clashed with the rest of his deck. I was unsuccessful in discouraging him from playing cards that did not further his primary strategy, especially a 3 card combo that he was unlikely to assemble. After smashing him multiple times with weak decks, he assembled the combo and destroyed me, likely setting him back a year or more as a deck builder because he became even more convinced that he was right.

Some people love to play wacky combos, and lose lots of games trying to assemble them. They don't care that they lose most of the time because if they ever succeed they will consider it all worth it. I am fine with this as long as they are not lying to themselves. I do it myself form time to time. My Capricious Efreet deck is BAD. But I once beat down a table of four players with them, and it was glorious. The key is to understand that it is not a good strategy, and to put your enjoyment in the pursuit, rather than success.

[Ciraxis]

Speaking of Black

(0) Lotus Bloom x2

(1) Dark Ritual x4, Sensei's Dividing Top x2, Sol Ring

(2) Exsanguinate x2, Stromgald Crusader x3

(3) Staff of Domination x2, Phyrexian Arena x3, Stillmoon Cavalier x3

(4) Liliana of the Dark Realms x2, Korlash, Heir to Blackblade x4, Damnation x3

(6) Sorin Markov

(7) Akroma's Memorial x2

(8) Griselbrand

Lands:

Cabal Coffers x2

Swamp x 23

This is Mono-Black (weeeell...not quite, I am looking at you Stillmoon!) deck I was cooking for some while. I think base idea is quite clear. Must say I am torn what to put in sideboard (Elixir's of Immortality?) and still don't know if Kozilek wouldn't be better then Gris...Any toughts?

[weesh]

As with any ramp deck, you have to deal with balance between the ramp and the expensive stuff. It is hard to tell by looking at it if you have hit that balance.

Of some concern are the 0 and 1 drops other than sol ring. All of the other 8 are card disadvantage, and 8 is a lot, even if they are powerful. This is also hard to judge though.

I think I would have to play with or against it to make a determination, but it seems like a risky deck to play and the payoff of a good hand is somewhat erratic. You don't really have the tools to protect Liliana, and your only non-planeswalker removal kills your own creatures as well.

I'm not sure I could play this deck well. What kind of cards to you accelerate with your dark rituals early in the game? Obviously the arena would be worth it, as would Gris, but lots of the other cards seem wasteful of that acceleration. It would be hard for me to know if I should save them or not.

[Ciraxis]

Yes...

I am myself aren't that sure about this construction, zombie knights just don't do as expected. I am thinking about adding Stuffy Doll and Tendrils of Corruption. I guess it's better to change it to something like this...

(1) Dark Ritual x4, Sensei's Dividing Top, Sol Ring,Candelabra of Tawnos, Bubbling Muck x2,

(2) Exsanguinate x3

(3) Staff of Domination x1, Phyrexian Arena x4, Oppression

(4) Liliana of the Dark Realms x2, Korlash, Heir to Blackblade x4, Black Sun Zenith x2, Greed x2, Tendrils of Corruption x3

(5) Stuffy Doll x2

(6) Sorin Markov

(8) Griselbrand

Lands:

Cabal Coffers x2

Swamp x 23

I also considered to cut one Swamp and add Kokusho, just for giggles.

[Erlenmeyer]

Here's a little standard deck I brewed up in Cockatrice (works on PC, Mac, & Linux, thus making it the best mtg application ever.):

Lunar Banishment (UW Control/aggro)

4 Fiend Hunter

4 Cloudshift

4 Ghostly Flicker

4 Oblivion Ring

4 Restoration Angel

4 Sword of War and Peace

4 Seachrome Coast

6 Island

4 Dissipate

2 Venser, the Sojourner

8 Plains

4 Snapcaster Mage

4 Cavern of Souls

4 Archon of Justice

SB: 3 Dispatch

SB: 2 Sudden Disappearance

SB: 3 Divine Deflection

SB: 4 Celestial Purge

SB: 3 Leonin Relic-Warder

The premise of the deck is to send your opponent's guys to the moon to get in with copious amounts of damage. On fiend hunter, there's a rule where if he returns to the battlefield before his second ability resolves, the exiled creature stays exiled FOREVER! That's where the blink spells come in. I can mass exile a bunch of creatures using o-rings, fiend hunter + cloudshift/restoration angel/ghostly flicker, dispatch (sb), and Celestial purge (sb). Snapcaster squeezes extra value off those blink spells and exile spells from the sideboard. What do you guys think?

[weesh]

Yes...

I am myself aren't that sure about this construction, zombie knights just don't do as expected. I am thinking about adding Stuffy Doll and Tendrils of Corruption. I guess it's better to change it to something like this...

You have a candelabra? WOW!

I think black sun's zenith is a good add, but makes stuffy doll bad. You should go back to damnation if you want stuffy doll.

Let us know how it works.

...The premise of the deck is to send your opponent's guys to the moon to get in with copious amounts of damage. On fiend hunter, there's a rule where if he returns to the battlefield before his second ability resolves, the exiled creature stays exiled FOREVER!...

Ah, that explains what I was missing. I have used those rules to exile all lands forever with Realm Razer.

It looks fun, but slow. Neither aggressive or controlling. I'd call it mid-range.

I see nothing to cast on turns one or two unless you want to cast snapcaster mage without anything to target. And some of the cheap spells want to be played with other spells which delays them further.

Maybe grab some counterspells or mana leaks over a dissipate so you can do something on turn two.

The manabase is a bit tricky to analyze because the lands aren't grouped together, but I only see 22, which is low for a deck that cannot miss its fourth land drop, and really wants its fifth and sixth.

[Ciraxis]

Here's a little standard deck I brewed up in Cockatrice (works on PC, Mac, & Linux, thus making it the best mtg application ever.):

Lunar Banishment (UW Control/aggro)

4 Fiend Hunter

4 Cloudshift

4 Ghostly Flicker

4 Oblivion Ring

4 Restoration Angel

4 Sword of War and Peace

4 Seachrome Coast

6 Island

4 Dissipate

2 Venser, the Sojourner

8 Plains

4 Snapcaster Mage

4 Cavern of Souls

4 Archon of Justice

SB: 3 Dispatch

SB: 2 Sudden Disappearance

SB: 3 Divine Deflection

SB: 4 Celestial Purge

SB: 3 Leonin Relic-Warder

The premise of the deck is to send your opponent's guys to the moon to get in with copious amounts of damage. On fiend hunter, there's a rule where if he returns to the battlefield before his second ability resolves, the exiled creature stays exiled FOREVER! That's where the blink spells come in. I can mass exile a bunch of creatures using o-rings, fiend hunter + cloudshift/restoration angel/ghostly flicker, dispatch (sb), and Celestial purge (sb). Snapcaster squeezes extra value off those blink spells and exile spells from the sideboard. What do you guys think?

Heh, I like that. Especially since it's very similiar to casual Venser deck I posted a while back in this topic. it suits my playing style.

[Ciraxis]

You have a candelabra? WOW!

I think black sun's zenith is a good add, but makes stuffy doll bad. You should go back to damnation if you want stuffy doll.

Let us know how it works.

I have other rare goodies including Mishra's Workshops (three copies) and even one Mox Jet (gulp!).

It's a very amusing story how I got theese (And one can wonder how they ended in Poland huh?) I will say other time.

I guess that Damnation is the better choice. Korlash after all is hust acceleration engine and isn't that important. At first Mutilate was going to be the option but I rejected it cose it killed Korlash no matter what.

Now that he is not win con anymore I guess Planar Chaos sweeper will be better choice. Still I will leave BSZ in sideboard just in case.

[TrinalHeart1103]

So I just got back from a 16 pool double elimination booster draft for M13. Ranked 2nd with an overall record of 12-5. Here was my deck list:

Creatures (12)

- Giant Scorpion x3

- Harbor Bandit x1

- Jace's Phantasm x3

- Kraken Hatchling x2

- Vampire Nighthawk x2

- Veldalken Entrancer x1

- Welkin Tern x2

Non-Creatures (10)

- Dark Favor x2

- Divination x1

- Mind Sculpt x2

- Negate x2

- Tricks of the Trade x2

- Sleep x1

Lands (18)

- Drowned Catacombs x1

- Island x9

- Swamp x8

The notable pulls that I saw from the tournmanet included 3 Nefarox and a Nico Bolas.

[weesh]

Wow, ZERO removal spells in a black deck? Thank goodness for all the death touchers.

Did you ever mill anyone out? Seems like almost anything would be better than the mill cards.

[TotalEcplise]

I just recently through a new Legacy Deck together that is protee boss. it's a Fair to Play deck, because it takes a couple turns to get started, but it works very nicely

Deck Name: Dragon Swarm:

Creatures:

|4x|Dragonbrood Mother

|4x|Balefire Dragon

|3x|Mordient Dragon

|4x|Dragonmaster Outcast

|4x|Dragonspeaker Shamen

|4x|Sakura-Tribe Elder

Artifacts:

|4x| Quicksilver Amulets

Instants/Sorceries:

|4x|Rampant Growth

|2x|Harrow

|3x|Cultivate

Enchantments:

|2x|Crucible of Fire

Land:

|4x|Copperling Gorge

|4x|Rootbound Craige

|6x|Forest

|9x|Mountain

This is a really fun deck to play and normally by turn 7 I'll have 20 dragons on the field because of Broodmother.

Oh my god Id love to play against your deck.

My dragons

Deck Name: Dragon surprise

Land

20x mountains

Creatures

4x Flameblast Dragon

4x Kilnmouth Dragon

4x mordant dragon

4x Hunted dragon

4x Zirilan of the claw

4x dragon speaker shaman

Sorceries and instants

4x rite of flame

4x seething song

Enchantments

4x braid of fire

2x electropotence

2x crucible of fire

At first I was scared to use only 20 lands but because of the way the deck works it turned out to never be an issue.

[TrinalHeart1103]

Wow, ZERO removal spells in a black deck? Thank goodness for all the death touchers.

Did you ever mill anyone out? Seems like almost anything would be better than the mill cards.

Haha, yeah I didn't see much in the way of removal get passed my way. As far as the mill cards, their main function was to activate Jace's Phantasm, turning them into 5/5s for 1 mana. Also, when most people draft into 40 card decks, 2 mana for a mill 7 is huge, and often times hits big cards. So, peudo-removal in a way.

[Ciraxis]

Today Ciraxis brings one of most wicked archetypes into this topic? What type you ask? ARTIFACTS! Muhahahah, tha table is mine! But decks thing first. Mono U artifact...

(0) Mox Opal, Ornithopter x4, Welding Jar x2

(1)Library of Leng, Ivory Tower, Sol Ring, Thran Turbine,

Reconstruction x2, Brainstorm x2, Power Sink x2

(2)Etherium Sculptor x4, Counterspell x3

(3)Master of Etherium x4, Cloudkey

(4)Vedalken Orrery, Unwinding Clock x2, Grinning Totem, Skyship Weatherlight

(5)Tezzeret the Seeker x2, Thoughtcast

(6) Steel Hellkite x2

(10)Kozilek, Butcher of Truth

Lands:

Seat of the Synod x4

Glimmervoid x4

Vesuva x3

Mishra's Workshop

Darksteel Citadel x2

Academy Ruins

Island x5

Sideboard:

Predator, Flagship

Arcum Dagsson x2

Inkwell Leviathan x2

Master Transmuter x4

Memnarch x 2

Thran Turbine x2

Wurmcoil Engine x1

Phyrexian Metamorph x4

Thoughtcast x2

It crashes, it smashes all....of course there is one weekness - not enought draw engine. Also my friends green decks offten puts decent fight against it. Any comments?

[weesh]

What format is this for? What format allows 2 brainstorms AND sol ring?

Looks super fun. Not terribly focused, but at this power level, you can give up some power for some variance.

Only one Workshop? Lame. [/sarcasm]

I was really confused about the inclusion of vesuva while I was reading it as Mishra's Factory.

*Is Library of Leng really worth it? How often does it do anything? If it were a reliquary tower it would at least be a mana. Similarly, Ivory tower looks ineffective since you won't tend to have a full hand. Or do you somehow?

*Seems like a solo Tolarian Academy would work well if you had one.

*Reconstruction is pretty classy. Its been a while since I've seen one in a deck.

*Is steel hellkite better than Wormcoil engine maindeck? My steel hellkites don't often survive to get to attack.

*Why isn't master transmuter maindeck?

*Do you like Kozilek better than some big bashing artifact creature?

[IceStorm]

A new deck that I've been running with. At the moment it's an online-only deck until I can afford the cards, but it's extremely powerful.

Creatures: 20

• |2x| Artisan of Kozilek
  
• |4x| Elvish Piper
  
• |4x| Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
  
• |4x| Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
  
• |2x| Pathrazer of Ulamog
  
• |4x| Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
  

Artifacts: 4

• |4x| Quicksilver Amulet
  

Enchantments: 3

• |3x| Omniscience
  

Instants: 6

• |3x| Counterspell
  
• |3x| Dissipate
  

Sorceries: 8

• |4x| Personal tutor
  
• |4x| Show and Tell
  

Land: 23

• |6x| Forest
  
• |17x| Island
  

Total cards 64.

This deck will have one of my ultimates on the field on turn three a good 75 percent of the time and by turn 5 100% of the time when starting hand is kept.