Could Fluttershy and/or Twilight Sparkle have Asperger's?

[punky]

I saw this on TV Tropes's Wild Mass Guessing page for the show. There is speculation that both Twilight Sparkle and Fluttershy have Asperger's Disorder. They cited the following examples:

Twilight Sparkle:

• has severe OCD. Best example is in "Lesson Zero", but we also see that she consistently keeps schedules. As a person with Asperger's, I can certainly confess I do this all the time.
  
• has difficulty reading other ponies' emotions and misinterprets slang. (in "Look Before You Sleep", there's a scene where she, Applejack, and Rarity are playing a guessing game with Twilight. When Applejack asks if they are hot are cold, Twilight takes it literally and asks if she needs to change the room temperature.
  
• Is socially awkward.
  
• her high levels of intelligence
  
• her refusal to believe in that which cannot be analyzed. (Pinkie sense, anyone?)
  

Fluttershy's symptoms:

• She's also socially awkward. Notice that she'd rather spend time with animals than ponies.
  
• Her inability to express emotions, particularly assertiveness.
  
• General naivete. (the "I'd like to be a tree" line)
  
• She's also had trouble interpreting social cues with others, particularly with Rainbow Dash. This may explain her inability to be corrupted by Discord. She clearly doesn't understand that the others may have opinions about her cowardice.
  

So, what do you folks think. Are these claims valid? I do know that I read somewhere that Lauren Faust wanted to give Twilight Asperger's, but Hasbro refused to let her because they thought children would have difficulty comprehending it. (but then, Arthur dealt with it once)

[Rosewind]

The ponies are not challenged with Asperger Syndrome, though it is nice that people with the disorder are able to relate to them on a special level like that. It's part of a spectrum disorder with varying degrees of severity. It would certainly be out of scope of the cartoon to assume they do have autism based on the way they act. If that's the case, I'm sure we could label the other Mane Four with various mental disorders based on their behavior in the cartoon.

[SirShadowdeath]

Looking a bit too far into this, aren't you?

[Rosewind]

Looking a bit too far into this, aren't you?

Since I've worked with autism for close to a decade, no.

Also Punky happens to be dealing with the challenges of Asperger syndrome (if he doesn't mind my saying so here).

[SirShadowdeath]

I meant into the personalities of the characters. Those are typical cartoon traits though. Each chracter represents basic cartoon stereotypes technically...(Nerdy/Book Worm, Optimistic Party Animal, Sporty Tomboy, etc.)

Wouldn't it just be a coicedence?

(P.S. Sorry If I accidently offended anyone)

[starswirlthebearded]

Looking a bit too far into this, aren't you?

Considering the scope of debates I've seen on this forum, this isn't so strange. but yes, he probably is

[Rosewind]

(P.S. Sorry If I accidently offended anyone)

Not I! Sorry if my tone came off a bit short. *huggles Shadow*

[flutterscotch]

Yeah, I know plenty of people who are just socially awkward rather neurotic and OCD and have been firmly diagnosed as not having anything in the autism spectrum. They were just sheltered as kids, whether it was self-imposed (in Twilight's case), or imposed by their parents.

[MyLittlePonyTales]

I do know that I read somewhere that Lauren Faust wanted to give Twilight Asperger's, but Hasbro refused to let her because they thought children would have difficulty comprehending it.

Really? Do you have a link?

(but then, Arthur dealt with it once)

Arthur dealt with some pretty heavy stuff. It cannot be compared to FiM. PBS is a different kind of channel altogether. It's made for education, and they get that kids have to go through some tough things in life. FiM is whimsical, and always will be.

[MyLittlePonyTales]

Yeah, I know plenty of people who are just socially awkward rather neurotic and OCD and have been firmly diagnosed as not having anything in the autism spectrum. They were just sheltered as kids, whether it was self-imposed (in Twilight's case), or imposed by their parents.

Haha. Yeah this is me.

[TheColtofPersonality]

Well as someone on the spectrum Twilight does have the rapid fire nature of the disorder (as in explaining a lot of things in rapid pacing) and social awkwardness is a part of the disorder.

[flutterscotch]

Yes, but part thereof does not necessarily denote a firm diagnosis. There are loads of overlapping symptoms with other things that may or may not be disorders. I explain things rapidly in somewhat nonsensical ways (to other people), and have been socially awkward (now, I just don't care), and know waaaaay too much about certain topics...only because I had a crappy childhood and my brain goes too fast for my mouth sometimes.

One thing that people seem to be getting is that Twilight shows a lot of empathy for people/ponies based on nonverbal cues (except spike who she clearly takes for granted), something that is supposedly hard for people with autism spectrum disorders.

Oh and that not everything has to be labeled and compartmentalized to make a character good, dynamic, and relatable to many, many types of people. So I guess 2 things.

[KingChrysalis]

No, they couldn't because they are cartoon characters.

/thread

[TotalEcplise]

While I don't believe any of the mane 6 have a disorder, none of them are 'normal'. But then again who is? I think they were just trying to say that everyone is quite crazy when the right buttons are pushed.

[flutterscotch]

While I don't believe any of the mane 6 have a disorder, none of them are 'normal'. But then again who is? I think they were just trying to say that everyone is quite crazy when the right buttons are pushed.

Pretty much.

[ONWARDconwardicus]

I happen to have a high functioning version of this disorder. I would say Twilight no but Flutter Shy maybe. There are 3 of 4 criteria she would have to meet first though. None of which I can remember. Brb google is in use.

Edit: I couldn't find them, but I did find out best diagnosis is in child(or in this case foal)hood. Because of both the mares' ages, no good diagnosis could be made.

[starswirlthebearded]

TIME TO BREAK OUT DSM-IV!

From that link Asperger Syndrome is qualified as

(I) Qualitative impairment in social interaction, as manifested by at least two of the following:

• 
  (A) marked impairments in the use of multiple nonverbal behaviors such as eye-to-eye gaze, facial expression, body posture, and gestures to regulate social interaction
  (B) failure to develop peer relationships appropriate to developmental level
  © a lack of spontaneous seeking to share enjoyment, interest or achievements with other people, (e.g.. by a lack of showing, bringing, or pointing out objects of interest to other people)
  (D) lack of social or emotional reciprocity
  

(II) Restricted repetitive & stereotyped patterns of behavior, interests and activities, as manifested by at least one of the following:

• 
  (A) encompassing preoccupation with one or more stereotyped and restricted patterns of interest that is abnormal either in intensity or focus
  (B) apparently inflexible adherence to specific, nonfunctional routines or rituals
  © stereotyped and repetitive motor mannerisms (e.g. hand or finger flapping or twisting, or complex whole-body movements)
  (D) persistent preoccupation with parts of objects
  

(III) The disturbance causes clinically significant impairments in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.

(IV) There is no clinically significant general delay in language (E.G. single words used by age 2 years, communicative phrases used by age 3 years)

(V) There is no clinically significant delay in cognitive development or in the development of age-appropriate self help skills, adaptive behavior (other than in social interaction) and curiosity about the environment in childhood.

(VI) Criteria are not met for another specific Pervasive Developmental Disorder or Schizophrenia."

Just saying, none of the characters fit into the criteria as proposed by the DSM-IV. Thus this discussion is moot.

[ONWARDconwardicus]

Thank you. That's what I was trying to find.

[starswirlthebearded]

Thank you. That's what I was trying to find.

Science: teaches how to research like none other. (Seriously, look at a journal article and see how many references there are)

[elsporko]

In Twilights case its not a matter of not reading social cues, she is socially awkward because she isolated herself. I wouldn't say she is OCD in Lesson Zero, rather she has high anxiety and over worries. things. She is freaking out because she is assuming punishment is coming that isn't. Twilight also came to terms with Pinkie sense as something that she can accept even if she doesn't understand it

The Fluttershy arguments don't make it either. Fluttershy is able to express emotions, she does it all the time. Her lack of assertiveness isn't a failure to show emotion, its being scared. Thats also the reason she likes animals, they are weaker then her and need her to take care of them. It makes her feel empowered. I don't see her being overally naive or unable to read social cues. That never seems to have come up.