Portrayal of men in MLP

[weesh]

Here is a survey of the non-antagonist male characters (that have talked and gotten significant screen time) with a brief description of each:

Spike: Often a voice of reason, compassionate, has trouble focusing, dependable, loyal

Big Mac: shy, hard worker

Snips/Snails: nerdy fanboys, dumb

Fancy Pants: navigates high society with ease, but open minded, courteous, respectful and kind.

Mr. Cake: adept parent and baker

Hoity Toity: fashionista

Sorin: pie loving jock

Shining Armor: Powerful magic user, leader, great brother

Filthy Rich: good father, boring, money obsessed

Pony Joe: down to earth pastry chef

Thunderlane: talented slacker

Flex: excitable, loud, jock

Braeburn: pioneer, family oriented

Sherrif Silverstar: steriotypical western sherrif

Chief Thunderhooves: Action oriented, reasonable, boring

Cranky Doodle: spent life searching for love, depressed

Gustave: stereotypical french chef

Firstly, feel free to write better summaries, or to add characters, and this post shall be edited.

Secondly, some questions:

1) Is the portrayal of men in the series important? Why or why not?

2) What is your overall impression of how men are portrayed?

3) Which character best exemplifies good traits for a man?

4) Do the portrays of any of these men hurt the series? Who and why?

Edited February 22, 2013 by weesh

[Bellosh]

Filthy Rich: boring and money obsessed

As his roleplayer, I'd say that the most important thing about Filthy is that even though he's probably the richest pony in town, he's still down to earth compared to his Canterlot brethren. In fact, it's a bit odd that his daughter turned out to be a brat.

Anyway, I'll probably post in-length later, because I'm lazy.......

[weesh]

As his roleplayer, I'd say that the most important thing about Filthy is that even though he's probably the richest pony in town, he's still down to earth compared to his Canterlot brethren. In fact, it's a bit odd that his daughter turned out to be a brat.

If you rewrite his summary, I'll use yours.

Anyway, I'll probably post in-length later, because I'm lazy.......

The reason my thoughts aren't typed yet is because they are not easy questions to answer.

This was almost a "where are the good men?" but it disintegrated when the information was pulled together. A little more time is needed for contemplation.

[RarityDash]

Pretty sure Little Strongheart is supposed to be female actually.

As for the questions, let me see...:

1) Is the portrayal of men in the series important? Why or why not?

I dunno. I'm not sure it's so important whether the characters are male or female, so long as they're characters that can be identified with or simply enjoyed as characters. Male or female characters just doesn't seem to matter to me as much as good characters. Though if I had to look at it from another angle, there are probably enough shows for the target age range with the focus more on the male characters that an approach here where the focus is more on the female is not at all unwelcome.

2) What is your overall impression of how men are portrayed?

All right, I guess. I mean, the male characters aren't quite as exciting, I suppose, but we have some pretty good characters in there. Spike is pretty critical to the dynamic of the show, and Shining Armor is a very likable and cool male character. Perhaps males as a whole are somewhat out of focus, but I wouldn't say they're portrayed badly.

3) Which character best exemplifies good traits for a man?

Not exactly sure about the question since I don't know exactly what "good traits for a man" entails. It's kind of an awkward question. I'm not sure I believe good traits for a man and for a woman are all so different. If instead the question was which male character exemplifies the most good traits, I'd go with Shining Armor; he's compassionate, strong and a leader. Spike is a great character too though.

4) Do the portrays of any of these men hurt the series? Who and why?

Nope. I really don't see why they would. There's a lot more to a character than male or female. Perhaps you can point to the male characters as being fewer and more stock, but it doesn't matter. It's a show filled with great characters. That's what is important.

[Lerian]

1) Absolutely. Half (approx) the people the audience, intended or not, are going to meet will be male, so for the younger audience it is good to give an impression of the world, for the older audience it makes the world/story more 'real' *

2) Overall I like it, it shows both good and bad and often explains or hints at why they are good or bad. See reasoning above.

3) Tricky, because that can be so subjective. Personally I like big Mac but is that because I'm often shy myself? Filthy Rich would probably do well as the protagonist in an 80's movie, especially with his 'down to earth' family background. A self made family if not a self made man (or is he?). I would like to make friends with a guy like Fancy pants because of his open mindedness and general 'Good guy' status. (Or am I just trying to get access to his money, connections and lifestyle due to my own 'less than upper-class' upbringing?).

4) Initially I had this impression about Snips and Snails, it seemed like they, (the writers), had taken the 'Haha look at the silly boys, right girls?' route that seems to go in and out of popularity with sit-coms but due to the show having other positive and interesting male characters I think that may not be the case or a one-off. (Either way I'm not as flank-hurt about it as I used to be)

*In as much as it helps with suspension of disbelief because, you know, magical talking ponies.

Also

Hey, what are you doing calling Thunderlane a slacker? Is it because of that one time Rainbow Dash called him lazy? He was ill! You think that talent happens overnight? You don't know what he goes though, man! Get off his back!

[weesh]

Pretty sure Little Strongheart is supposed to be female actually.

Oops! you seem to be right, I have removed her from the list.

3) Which character best exemplifies good traits for a man?

Not exactly sure about the question since I don't know exactly what "good traits for a man" entails. It's kind of an awkward question. I'm not sure I believe good traits for a man and for a woman are all so different. If instead the question was which male character exemplifies the most good traits, I'd go with Shining Armor; he's compassionate, strong and a leader. Spike is a great character too though.

While similar, they are not exactly the same. Women and men are physiologically, emotionally and mentally different. I need to think about what specifically the differences are, but they should exist. I'll get back to this later.

[colour=#282828]Hey, what are you doing calling Thunderlane a slacker? Is it because of that [/colour]one time[colour=#282828] Rainbow Dash called him lazy? He was ill! You think that talent happens overnight? You don't know what he goes though, man! Get off his back![/colour]

Then write us a better one, or should I just remove him from the list? We don't really know that much about him. It had seemed that he was a slacker before he got sick though. Unless the symptoms take a long time to develop, which is inconsistent with the story. But, maybe he had a low grade fever, and his immune system was already weak before he started hanging out with other sick ponies.

[elsporko]

The guys are as varied as the ladies but not featured as much because at its core the show is for little girls.

[Bellosh]

Time for my responses!

1. I would say that's quite a toughie to answer. Outside of the vital "little brother" and "big brother" roles filled by Spike and Shining Armor, males don't really have an important role to play in the storyline for FiM. Any other male that's seen on the show is probably there because the animators needed a simple way to differentiate characters from one another.

2. While they hardly get much spotlights, I think that males are portrayed fairly. I like seeing that the show has yet to resort to featuring any sort of "battle of the sexes" plotlines in which the boys lose because they're in a girls' show.

3. Can't answer that question because the show itself has never made light of the issue of gender roles.

4. Not at all, and it will never happen as long as the writers stay away from the scenario outlined in Response #2.

[weesh]

1) Regarding the portrayal of men, there are several levels that the show could strive towards. Firstly, they intentionally avoided romantic love and focused on friendships, which is one of the best decisions made in the show. They could go a step further and have more males that are friends, because modeling such things wouldn't be a bad idea in a society where it can be hard to be "just" friends with others of the opposite sex. I'd say "important" but they aren't failing this one.

2) I made this topic because it was hard to think of good male characters. Sure there are Shining Armor and Fancy Pants, but the rest are unsatisfying. Many have little depth, little screen time, are cliches, etc. While it isn't a deal-breaker for this part of the series to be weak, it is disappointing.

3) Fancy Pants, for the short period that we got to know him, showed open mindedness and love to all those around him, from the first moment to the last. He edges out Shining armor.

4) While it is hard to say that any of the characters hurt the show, there are some missed opportunities. Snips and Snails could have been portrayed with more respect, but still been troublemakers and thick skinned enough to not let teasing get to them. Sorin could have been the one male jock that was deeper than loving pie.

[elsporko]

Snips and Snails aren't really trouble makers, they are just dumb.

[weesh]

Snips and Snails aren't really trouble makers, they are just dumb.

Which was the problem. It would be better for the characters if they were intelligent and silly, or intelligent and troublemakers.

[SteelEagle]

[colour=#282828]1) Is the portrayal of men in the series important? Why or why not?[/colour]

Yes, as regardless of gender, characterization is a vital part of any show's success

[colour=#282828]2) What is your overall impression of how men are portrayed? [/colour]

On the whole, extremely well. Are there many roles? Not too many, but I don't think it detracts much and those that are shown are almost always done so well.

[colour=#282828]3) Which character best exemplifies good traits for a man?[/colour]

Define what you believe traits for men are. Big Mac is kind and a tirelessly hard worker who doesn't lose sight of family; Shining Armor is honorable, courageous, noble, a fantastic and caring sibling and a great leader; Fancy Pants is open minded despite living in a city that is close-minded; Braeburn has that pioneering spirit that lets you make your mark on the world. For my money, I'm partial to Big Mac's virtues.

[colour=#282828]4) Do the portrays of any of these men hurt the series? Who and why?

Nah. Not even Snips and Snails hurt the series. There are dumb kids out there; you had to have some dumb fillies or colts, and it happened to be them![/colour]

[Mojo]

HAY! You forgot Sheriff Silverstar, the stereotypical Western lawpony!

However, the one big thing we all have to keep in mind about the world of Equestria is that it was meant to be a matriarchal society.

Women rule and are the dominant gender here, and of course, that's because it was designed that way by Hasbro!

After all, as much as we all LOVE the cartoon show and the MLP FiM 'universe', we must keep in mind the MAIN motive of its creators: To sell pony toys to preteen girls. Thus, Equestria is a female-dominant place where men are little more than just background characters.

I'm not complaining about this because I believe, as a whole, women are under-represented in society. The question of how men are portrayed in MLP FiM should be seen through the lens of the show's creators. Men are the 'weaker' gender in Equestria, that's just how it stands.

[brianblackberry]

Reading this reminds me of the ridiculous post an anti-pony friend sent me today, attempting to convince me Friendship Is Magic is misandrist (that is, anti-male); it is a common trope that I get based on the idea in order to have female empowerment, men somehow must be emasculated, as if equal rights were somehow a zero sum game.

Sure some of the male characters are portrayed as dumb or goofy (like Snips and Snails), but as Weesh pointed out, several are positive role models (Big Mac, Braeburn, Shining Armor), other are shown with wealth and power (Fancy Pants, Filthy Rich, Hoity Toity), I could go on.

For Spike, I would add that he is dependable and loyal. Who is always there to help Twilight in that moment of need when the other five need rescuing or otherwise incapacitated? Spike.

Fancy Pants lampshades the rich guy trope; he is respected and admired (and even possibly feared) by the other ponies in high society but he treats everypony with courtesy and respect and kindness.

For Braeburn I would also add he is an entrepreneur; this may be true of Pony Joe as well.

Filthy Rich - Also a good father who cares deeply for his daughter.

Secondly, some questions:

1) Is the portrayal of men in the series important? Why or why not?

2) What is your overall impression of how men are portrayed?

3) Which character best exemplifies good traits for a man?

4) Do the portrays of any of these men hurt the series? Who and why?

1. It is important only in the sense that males should not be stereotyped or typed cast when shown or have dialog. We all know the show is aimed at a female audience and seeks to show that audience positive female role models, so that should be paramount. There is no need for male-female parity, because there are so many male dominated shows for kids out there already.

2. At first I wasn't too happy, because we only really had a few male figures of note, any other were unnamed ponies with goofy voices. Snips and Snails were parodies of the whole "boys have cooties" thing, but as the show went on the portrayal of various male characters improved.

3. Probably Shining Armor if I had to pick one. He is a success on his own (captain of the royal guard) who was elevated to prince; he is powerful (cast a spell to protect the city of Canterlot); brave, loyal, good humored, humble, and compassionate.

4. No I don't think it does.

[weesh]

Thank you everyone that has taken the time to put thought into responses.

1. It is important only in the sense that males should not be stereotyped or typed cast when shown or have dialog. We all know the show is aimed at a female audience and seeks to show that audience positive female role models, so that should be paramount. There is no need for male-female parity, because there are so many male dominated shows for kids out there already.

That makes a lot of sense. Well said.

[Cadabra]

This is a REEEEALY good topic.

1) Is the portrayal of men in the series important? Why or why not?

They are an uncommon occurance within the show, and tend to be there to help move the plot forward when needed. We see more females due to the demographic audience of little girls.

2) What is your overall impression of how men are portrayed?

They are more or less like Ken is to the Barbie doll. A perfect example: The Hearts and Hooves Day. The Cutie Mark Crusaders are practically shopping around for a guy for heavens sake! And they found a Jelly Pony! Though Toy Story 3 did show that a Ken doll can be equal to his Barbie. I'm sure that if given a chance Big Mac or Shining Armor could lead an episode.

3) Which character best exemplifies good traits for a man?

Mr. Cake. He is a hard working man, a supportive husband, and a loving father. Best of all, he works as a team with his wife, and they communicate brilliantly. Their relationship is not perfect, or even glamours, but they are willing to work on it together.

Communication is the key to a strong marriage, and I would love to see more of they're relationship in episodes as a way to teach this to children. I think it would be great to show this to kids not only for what lies ahead of their relationships, but to help them understand what their parents relationship is.

To many people learn to fall in love with the idea of love, and they expect to have the love story they watched, read, and had pumped into their minds since childhood happen to them. A good example is Rarity and Blue Blood, and how her ideas about love had to be measured up against reality. This is why I like Best Night Ever so much, because her prefabricated expectations go wrong for all the right reasons.

4) Do the portrays of any of these men hurt the series? Who and why?

I do not feel they hurt the series at all. Men help move the plot forward, and the writers do a good job using them.

On a side note: WHY U NO PUT ROID RAGE PONEH? He's a personal favorite. When I first saw him I about wet myself laughing.

[weesh]

3) Which character best exemplifies good traits for a man?

Mr. Cake. He is a hard working man, a supportive husband, and a loving father. Best of all, he works as a team with his wife, and they communicate brilliantly. Their relationship is not perfect, or even glamours, but they are willing to work on it together.

Communication is the key to a strong marriage, and I would love to see more of they're relationship in episodes as a way to teach this to children. I think it would be great to show this to kids not only for what lies ahead of their relationships, but to help them understand what their parents relationship is.

To many people learn to fall in love with the idea of love, and they expect to have the love story they watched, read, and had pumped into their minds since childhood happen to them. A good example is Rarity and Blue Blood, and how her ideas about love had to be measured up against reality. This is why I like Best Night Ever so much, because her prefabricated expectations go wrong for all the right reasons.

Very true, I love the team aspect of their relationship.

On a side note: WHY U NO PUT ROID RAGE PONEH? He's a personal favorite. When I first saw him I about wet myself laughing.

I've been calling him "Flex", is their an "official" name for him yet? He was excluded for the same reason Time Turner was: there is no in show development of his personality.

[Cadabra]

I've been calling him "Flex", is their an "official" name for him yet? He was excluded for the same reason Time Turner was: there is no in show development of his personality

YEAAAAaaaaaah you've right. Good point.

[FatherNiwa]

1) Is the portrayal of men in the series important? Why or why not?

The portrayal of men in the series is very important. Considering the fanbase the show has gained and its depiction of women redefining stereotypes. Its important to not let men take a backseat to them and still have them play a part in the series.

2) What is your overall impression of how men are portrayed?

Overall I'd say the men are portrayed positively in the series. Almost none are portrayed negatively unless they're helping to move the story along or develop character.

3) Which character best exemplifies good traits for a man?

Shining Knight, Mr. Cake, and Big Mac (my favorite)

4) Do the portrays of any of these men hurt the series? Who and why?

No most of the males have their own quirks but it doesn't take away from their good personalities.